=== Let's Drone Out — Episode 209 ===
Title: LDO 209 - The Return of Painless 360 and the Law-Abiding Andy RC
Recorded: 2019-08-29
Hosts: Andy, Jack "Brightontillifly" Nash, Wayne "CurryKitten" Andrews, Tony "TheTonstar1" Marchant, Andrew "Frank" Hyams
Guest(s): Lee "Painless360" Schofield
Total audience: 2,102
Platforms: YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M-cpf4TYx7s); SoundCloud (http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/673206647-letsdroneout-ldo-209-the-return-of-painless-360-and-the-law-abiding-andy-rc.mp3)
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[0.0] AndyRC: Hello and you're listening to the best drone podcast out there. Let's drone out.
[4.48] AndyRC: We would like to thank all of our Patreons including
[8.24] AndyRC: Mikey Dredd as well as Art Faulkner and
[13.2] Jack: That's it. We've only got two out of the four twelve dollar Patreons
[19.36] Jack: who would help pay for the editing for this train wreck of a show.
[24.24] Jack: If you want to get your name read out please donate
[28.0] Jack: to patreon.com forward slash Let's Drone Out.
[63.97] Jack: Welcome to a wonderful NJ Techless episode of Let's Drone Out. We really miss him.
[71.01] Jack: Tonight we are joined by Daddy, Curry Kitten. Hello.
[76.37] Jack: Andrew slash Frank. Hello.
[78.37] Jack: We're joined by My Little Tony. Oh sure.
[81.81] Jack: We are joined also by Bot and
[91.81] Jack: I'll just read out what's there. We are also joined by Andy RC.
[98.21] Jack: How do.
[99.89] Jack: And everyone's favorite and informative and this show might actually talk about drones
[104.29] Jack: and only 10% about penises, penis 360.
[108.21] Lee: Hello. I'm actually not completely sure why I'm on here so let me be honest.
[113.09] Lee: So same as everyone else then.
[115.73] Lee: So yeah I mean they I'm in the same boat as all of you lad so you know we'll just we'll just we'll
[119.97] Lee: just go with the flow. But I'll tell you what though we can start the conversation that you
[124.37] Lee: and I were nearly having there Curry. You were you were asking me about and talking about flying
[130.29] Lee: days because I see from your Instagram you've actually made it out to fly a couple of things.
[134.69] Curry: You tooth picking today was it? I was tooth picking today. I was trying to shove a decent
[140.37] Curry: camera into the South flight X which is now made of more parts that it didn't come with
[145.33] Curry: than it did come with but now it flies better. And yeah the other day I was out with a wing
[150.53] Curry: after we talked about using auto trim on iNav which actually worked really well. Fantastic.
[157.49] Curry: Please does it do the leveling. If you haven't quite got your reflex right which I hadn't
[163.01] Curry: so I was pulling up a bit it does that for you as well. You just put it into auto trim
[167.81] Curry: you you get it straight for about a second and then it takes that and if you like that you come
[172.61] Curry: down and land it in disarm and it accepts that. And if you don't like it you switch off you switch
[177.81] Curry: back on you can do it. Interesting days I found out because what happened is I had this plane
[183.81] Curry: set up and we tested it out we had some problems with it and I came back and I replaced the GPS
[189.33] Curry: and I thought I had it sorted and I went on holiday and I came back and my notes said
[193.01] Curry: planes ready. So when I threw it up in the air after crashing into the ground twice which is
[198.45] Curry: pretty much the normal. Far for the course. I was flying it fine and then I put it in angle mode
[204.85] Curry: so I was going along like this put it in angle mode it goes I'm upside down held beautifully
[209.09] Curry: upside down but not particularly useful as far as stabilization goes or return to home. I found out
[215.41] Curry: I'd reverse one of my channels in my radio instead of doing it through INAP caused a problem there.
[222.29] Curry: And then later on during my second battery when I was doing like a hundred percent throttle run
[227.41] Curry: see how fast it could go the motor cut out and I had to glide back home which I just about made
[234.37] Curry: without getting hit by cows which is good. Aside from that it was a fun day. Fantastic so servo
[241.01] Lee: auto trim tick and we now know that for INAP setup the first fundamental is sticks in the top
[248.21] Lee: right hand corner all the channel value should be maximum because if it isn't that you're in a house
[252.21] Curry: of cards. Yes now ironically enough I of course when I was at home I did my channel setups I looked
[259.57] Curry: at the surfaces and I put it in angle and I turned it like that and I was like yeah that looks like
[263.65] Curry: it's working right completely backwards but you face some sort of weird servo blindness when you're
[269.89] Curry: looking at it you could say that looks like it's going right but it wasn't. Yeah confirmation bias
[274.77] Lee: you think well yeah it should be okay it happens an awful lot with INAP and that's the reason I
[280.13] Lee: made that video about you know top five mistakes people make because it's so easy to do because
[286.77] Lee: it looks on the bench like it works perfectly because all the all the controls work in the
[290.69] Lee: right way the corrections in the right way you think I'm brilliant and really good you throw it
[295.09] Lee: first time you flick the switch to angle it kind of flips and rolls and dies
[299.73] Lee: and it's so easy to do because it looks on the bench like it's absolutely perfect
[304.77] Lee: but loads of people do it but I'm so I'm so pleased it's working for you because INAP on wings
[310.69] Lee: and I do playing on wings is my at the moment my kind of big thing I'm getting a massive kick out
[315.73] Curry: of doing that. Yes well I've yet to fly INAP properly so it was just for me it was just a pretty
[323.73] Curry: OSD but I mean auto trim worked really well but I want to I fixed it all so I just need to go
[329.65] Curry: and throw it up again and test all my modes now do work. So you haven't done your return to home
[334.05] Curry: and your lighter yet? No because it would just turn upside down so it would do a return to ground
[339.25] Jack: quite well but I could do that by myself. My wings pretty suicidal mine does the same but just
[349.89] Jack: left a nose down and I need to check the controls on that one but it flies beautifully
[360.29] Jack: back to me in GPS when I leave it in manual and just hope there isn't a gust of wind.
[366.21] Tony: So who went to the was it the Nationals? Yeah PMFA Nationals it was just you, me and the Fraser
[374.53] AndyRC: but the day before that we met up with Kelsey and her folks and we flew some spots which included
[383.25] Tony: the towers so we revisited the towers. I thought they were getting them knocked down or blown up.
[395.49] AndyRC: That notice has been removed. They're not doing it? Well they're still there and we were there and
[404.85] AndyRC: yeah I got through the little door but much less scary the more times you go you know.
[411.65] AndyRC: Yeah I bet. Yeah you know you know telling you said I never come here again because it was that
[416.93] AndyRC: scary. This time I was you know relaxed and confident. It's a stranger. It's been a few
[424.69] AndyRC: times now you know so it's definitely worth a second go but make sure that you don't wear nice
[433.01] AndyRC: shoes. Yes not white ones hey. I think I think Andy's foot and well when I got to the towers
[442.61] AndyRC: Andy was pretty much naked and he was hanging his clothes over. Did he fall in a ditch or something?
[451.41] Tony: Well what happened? What happened was you got to do it in the sound of Jeffro. Go on Andy.
[457.97] SPEAKER_03: So those are in Andy. You've got boots on. There's a bridge. Go test the bridge out.
[463.57] SPEAKER_03: It was just a bit of fasting on top of the water. Yeah. Do you really that old you look that your
[473.01] AndyRC: eyes are that bad? We have Kelsey to blame for this because she said oh they've added a bridge
[478.69] AndyRC: but no it's not her fault because we've had a lot of rain obviously and a lot and when we were there
[484.45] AndyRC: tone it was just a little bit of mud right. It was a full-blown stream this time. So someone
[492.29] AndyRC: had put like oh I don't know how you'd explain it but it was just like a piece of metal and soon as
[498.85] AndyRC: you stood on it your foot went straight through it. Oh dear. And yeah. Did they have um because when me and
[507.57] Tony: um Jack went to the first ever one uh they had little plane chukka planes what they feel the pipette
[516.29] AndyRC: to chukka ducks. Well that's what that's what Andy mainly wanted to go for the chukka duck and
[521.97] AndyRC: then we went to see that yes. So they had them there. Yeah that's that's basically what we went
[527.81] Tony: for wasn't it. I love that when me and Jack went that was about four years ago when we went to the
[532.85] Tony: first ever nationals. My favorite thing. All your friends Ben. What happened Jack? Well you've
[539.57] Jack: you've got love of boy Danny. Hi Danny in the chat. My favorite thing they had was a rocket so they had
[551.49] AndyRC: a compression rocket which every time I missed on film because it went it accelerated so quickly
[560.77] AndyRC: you couldn't see it but and uh it like it like it was just landing on people as well. It was uh
[567.49] SPEAKER_03: yeah so. And it seemed like every time that was about something you had your camera around then
[572.93] AndyRC: there was a free flight model a battle about to take us out. Oh yeah that was it. They call it
[577.97] AndyRC: chukka duck because it really if you if you ever want a panic a proper panic attack and you don't
[584.13] AndyRC: suffer from anxiety go there and that's about as close as you can get to a panic attack. Is that
[591.49] AndyRC: there's this just and like loads of people you think oh there's a flight line here we're safe
[596.93] AndyRC: there's there's a metal barrier and then all of a sudden people just start throwing things from
[601.33] AndyRC: behind there and then there must have been a couple of hundred people just just to throw in stuff
[608.21] AndyRC: and there's just like you know you know probably 20 things flying around in the air just no control
[614.69] AndyRC: whatsoever um but you know there's no uh control on the test so it's not a drone is it if it's uh
[623.97] AndyRC: if there's no control so. But you weren't convinced we were trying to kill you.
[629.25] AndyRC: Well well yeah because we did nearly all die.
[636.37] Curry: We never would have chopped and died. What are your actual injuries all we've heard so far as Frank fell in a pond essentially.
[643.25] AndyRC: He's hurt his thumb. Actually Fraser cut himself up on the nettles but didn't he have
[653.25] AndyRC: he sent a picture on the monday what happened on the monday Andy his his injury looks way worse than mine.
[660.61] SPEAKER_03: So on monday he did match the same thing as you did to yourself um so he came he came and did the thing um
[668.85] SPEAKER_03: but yeah so at the towers Andy had a mild incident um which required some uh source of first aid.
[678.37] SPEAKER_03: We uh Jerry rigged a plaster out of some streamers a bit and a bit of day and date.
[687.65] Curry: So despite all these planes flying around your head you hurt yourself from plants. Yeah and you know
[693.57] AndyRC: what it was really it was no no this what it wasn't from plants it was really annoying because um
[699.89] AndyRC: I've been doing this for a long time and never had an injury from doing it and it was just it was
[705.41] AndyRC: the stupidest thing so at where the uh cooling towers are they've put a load of rocks at the
[714.45] AndyRC: bottom um and uh I was I was checking the the heat of the motors because I've got a new model
[723.49] AndyRC: and the motors are getting a little bit warm so I put my tyrannis uh upright uh actually actually
[731.57] AndyRC: no that that's not what it was I put it I put it flat um and I went up to the cockpit to feel
[739.25] AndyRC: the motors and because there's rocks everywhere uh the rock it just must have slipped and hit the
[746.85] AndyRC: arm switch whilst I was holding the motor and that you it's not too bad but this is why I have
[756.93] AndyRC: motor stop enabled all times yeah but you can't you can't do proper flying with motor stop and
[764.93] Curry: yeah well you can you just have air mode on a switch I turn air mode on and off as I fly
[770.29] Jack: yeah I've I've got potato mode as well I've got an ID I use idle up I'd look if I don't
[776.45] Jack: flick my switch all the way it goes into what I class as potato mode I'm gonna uh after this
[783.89] AndyRC: incident um I mean it's like a one it was like such a uh like the chances of it happening were
[791.89] Tony: just crazy yeah but that's all it takes I saw yeah I saw a post on Facebook with someone's
[797.97] Tony: half of someone's face missing from a helicopter accident today and I was like oh my god I tell you
[804.77] Jack: about that a line tracks will hunt me down again look look it's the halfway mark painless talk
[811.65] Curry: about something he's getting a lot of questions about the um the goggles which are they again
[817.49] Curry: the OLED uh is it the sky zone goggles yeah these are the new sky zone sky zero three o's which is
[826.05] Lee: really difficult to figure out what which is zero which isn't oh so when I first got them I was trying
[830.77] Lee: to google everything and I tried it with two o's then two zeros and eventually there's a magic
[835.33] Lee: combo these are the new oled goggles from sky zone that have just come out pretty premium price
[843.25] Lee: but their oled they have inbuilt diversity inbuilt head tracker they have a new updated menu system
[850.21] Lee: new updated dvr wider ipd than fat sharks do and they are probably the best non-fat
[861.25] Lee: shot goggles that I have ever tried they're absolutely fantastic um I really like rapid fire
[868.53] Lee: as the receiver in my fat shark goggles because it does it's not for those of you that
[873.73] Lee: that know about rapid fire apologies I'll just digress for a moment um the the way that these
[880.61] Lee: new systems work because I don't know if you saw TBS is coming out with a new uh smart diversity
[887.01] Lee: module um so there's a number of them around now like the true x and the and these and what
[894.13] Lee: they do is they're not just switching between two receivers they're listening to both receivers all
[898.13] Lee: the time and they they're reconstructing the best image you can possibly get so in normal flying
[903.89] Lee: because there are loads of questions about well how did the two receivers in the sky zones
[909.73] Lee: compare with things like rapid fire and the answer is ninety nine percent of the time you're
[916.21] Lee: probably not going to see any difference but that one percent that you are is going to make the
[921.33] Lee: difference between you crashing and getting your quad back because when you're at the extremes or
[926.29] Lee: when you're flying in really tricky situations that's when the rapid fire uh for me anyway seems
[931.41] Lee: to do a better job of kind of meldging to really crappy fpv signals into something half useful
[938.21] Lee: with the first thing you don't have that option the sensitivity um somebody answered i think it
[943.65] Lee: was one of the sky zone guys actually answered the question about sensitivity the receivers
[948.53] Lee: i don't as part of my tests fly beyond legal range just because i don't want to be that
[955.73] Lee: guy that gets reported to uh to the authorities so and in all the testing that i've done they've
[961.17] Lee: been absolutely fantastic uh if i wasn't bothered about rapid fire um these would probably be
[967.73] Lee: my favorite goggles but these ones that i've seen mg fpv putting on she put on today yeah i think
[975.33] Lee: she's got the light blue pair light blue ones yeah i got the red one they're like seven different
[980.85] Lee: colors but okay the optics are really nice it's not a massive field of view i think it's 35 37
[986.53] Lee: something like that um but it's it's the first set of goggles that i've ever kind of had a go
[992.61] Lee: of and thought yeah yeah i think that yeah i could i could use these every day without a problem um
[998.61] Lee: and you know you guys know how often you know my daily drivers are all the fat shark uh hdo ones
[1005.33] Lee: yeah um and the screen is gorgeous you know they have the hdmi input uh really really impressed
[1011.89] Lee: i love the fact it's got things like the head tracker in it so you know for me it's like it's
[1016.37] Lee: a it's a five star set of goggles but with all these things give it six months there'll be
[1021.17] Tony: something else out there for less money are they cheaper than the um 354 quid so if you if you were
[1031.09] Tony: new into the game they'd be worth buying over over a fat shark i i'm really upset a lot of people
[1038.85] AndyRC: because i put them up against the rapid fire which absolutely walked all over it so i so i
[1047.09] AndyRC: set my quad to 25 milliwatt same quad i even had the fat sharks with the rapid fire around my neck
[1056.29] AndyRC: so not ideal location uh i then got um a family member to walk over the other side of the field
[1065.01] AndyRC: to make sure that there was um nobody walking that way and i i was flying with the sky zones
[1074.45] AndyRC: and i went behind a tree and there's this tree has sort of like a bit that you can
[1081.25] AndyRC: fly through uh with the rapid fires uh and i showed that and then i took the sky zones
[1089.81] AndyRC: and as soon as it went behind the tree it was complete wipeout yeah and uh people were saying
[1096.93] AndyRC: uh you should it's not fair to compare these against and i'm just saying no you don't understand
[1104.37] AndyRC: you know yeah i i i mentioned in my video if you if you don't require this extra thing that rapid
[1112.93] AndyRC: fire gives then if you're just flying in a field that doesn't have any objects or and things like
[1120.21] AndyRC: that then then they are great but if you are expecting to go to a bando like me and andy were
[1127.25] AndyRC: at at the weekend and it'd be useful no sorry so uh i upset a lot of people saying that also they
[1137.09] AndyRC: don't have a super cap big problem for me but anyways carry on it's easy to um forget just how
[1145.41] Curry: good rapid fire is because i tested the the true dx and the our c module that all proposed to do
[1151.89] Curry: this thing about reconstructing a frame yeah and what i do i i take a little quad and i fly here
[1157.41] Curry: in my room and i fly out out into my garden around the alley to really create some really
[1163.25] Curry: bad static in the multi-passing and rapid fire copes with that so well and all the others fall
[1168.53] Curry: over uh but that said if i found as well if you're out in the middle of a big field flying around
[1174.77] Curry: they all look exactly the same it's only when you put it under pressure that you you get the
[1179.01] Curry: difference um and it's easy to to forget about that because i i might get used to flying anywhere now
[1185.41] Curry: around trees and stuff and if you suddenly do that on a different pair of goggles it's like
[1189.97] Curry: well what's going on what's happening my receiver all of a sudden that's why i'm saying about the
[1194.37] Lee: fact that the lack of a module bay the lack of a bay to change the receivers is is kind of the only
[1200.21] Lee: kind of showstopper for me uh the interestingly they came back to me and um and said oh we saw the
[1206.21] Lee: review you know thanks for doing that have you got any suggestions and they gave them a list of five
[1210.61] Lee: things that they they should change on the goggles and haven't heard anything back so i don't know
[1214.85] AndyRC: if i'm persona non grata now because i gave them some suggestions well all i will say is after my
[1221.01] AndyRC: review i did not heard off them and they didn't send me the oled version so uh oh yeah okay you're
[1228.05] AndyRC: right yours wasn't the oled one yeah but they're the same receivers i believe um so uh yeah because
[1234.77] AndyRC: what i did i did the same test funnily enough so i i've got the new armway v1 s and the skyzone
[1244.61] AndyRC: um that it was the sky o2 x and i think they were um like everybody praised the how good the
[1253.65] AndyRC: receivers were in the skies the original sky o2 like at any time i did a goblin view anyone would
[1261.65] AndyRC: always and i'd say uh these are the best goggles at the moment someone would say no they're not
[1266.53] AndyRC: the sky o2s are um so um i i don't really like reviewing goggles they're such a pain to review
[1275.01] AndyRC: because they're such a personal thing um but i found that the i found that the ionway v1s
[1283.01] AndyRC: and the sky zero two performed rf wise they broke up exactly the same in exactly the same place
[1292.21] AndyRC: where rapid fire would let me go through the gap and you know until they'll see what's going on
[1300.05] AndyRC: so that that was the difference so um yeah so yeah it wasn't the oled ones but i can't imagine
[1307.57] AndyRC: that they they've done any anything special to the receivers because rapid fire as you say it
[1312.93] AndyRC: smushes the two together and makes the the best of what it's receiving it's it's doing something
[1318.21] Lee: extra so i'm excited to see what the tbs one is because they're actually um collaborating with
[1323.49] Lee: brain fpv uh a bunch martin and those guys at brain fpv are very very clever people um i'm
[1330.53] Lee: excited to see what they've come up with because the thing is we all and this is the danger you
[1335.81] Lee: know we've all been in the game a long time we're very lucky we have access to lots of great
[1339.49] Lee: technology we all you know a lot of the majority of us fly rapid fire and um that can it can
[1346.13] Lee: sometimes mean that if you review a standard set of goggles you know if we could do air quotes
[1350.93] Lee: uh that has standard diversity you kind of feel that that is a substandard product but for
[1357.09] Lee: you know for the majority of pilots that's probably going to be absolutely you know
[1360.93] Lee: two years ago we'd have all given our right arm for that kind of functionality on goggles
[1365.09] Lee: but because we've had rapid fire and you go behind a tree and you go oh gee i've lost my
[1369.17] Lee: you know i've lost my fpv where normally you wouldn't you know you kind of it's it is it's
[1374.77] Lee: a very tricky one to review because everybody has very strongly held opinions and um
[1380.69] Lee: all of this stuff you know it's it's a little bit objective uh an awful lot of subjective
[1386.77] Lee: because a pair of goggles that fits my face beautifully and i love because of my big nose
[1391.97] Lee: you know someone else might put on say this is crap there's loads of light leaks it doesn't fit
[1395.73] Lee: my face very well it's you know so it there's no and lots of people at the moment particularly
[1402.21] Lee: in the comments i mean you know this andrew is that sometimes you can you can try and be as fair
[1407.25] Lee: as you possibly can with the review but someone will take an extreme position about one of the
[1411.49] Lee: comments that you've made um even though you try and couch it in terms of you know this is my my
[1416.77] Lee: experience of these goggles um you know they'll still they'll still be very aggressive because
[1421.65] Lee: they have have an axe to grind and you know where you know radios are kind of the same thing you
[1427.09] Lee: know you do a review of a radio and you go these sticks are okay and then someone will comment
[1432.13] Lee: and say no those sticks are crap they feel really rubbish and it's like well what are you comparing
[1436.37] Lee: it to because i'm comparing it to you know it's it's always tricky um frank i think the other thing
[1441.33] Lee: you wanted to talk about um because we can i'm just conscious of time and i know i think i have
[1447.41] Lee: a rough idea what you were after we spoke about the uh the bite frost stuff talking about fpv and
[1455.73] Lee: goggles and things did everybody see that the fat shock posted um in lots of different places
[1462.05] Lee: including instagram about the fact that bite frost has been delayed didn't did anyone see
[1467.49] Lee: i'll tell anyone not seeing that because if they haven't i'll quickly read it out
[1472.61] AndyRC: uh is bite frost their hd system yeah okay okay i didn't know well i knew i knew that when they
[1482.45] AndyRC: made the post that it was nowhere near ready and it was a strategic thing to block people from
[1488.53] AndyRC: buying the dji system that was clearly obvious um but i'm not surprised that it's been delayed
[1495.57] Lee: from what i've heard but carry on okay so for everybody that's listening on the podcast and he
[1500.85] Lee: was rolling his eyes sarcasm switch on for that little last bit um so so fat shot posted this and
[1507.89] Lee: what it says is major update on bite frost originally bite frost uh from the stuff that
[1512.69] Lee: i saw was due to be out this month and then of course dji came out with a spectacular hd system
[1519.73] Lee: uh it should be because it's you know it's not cheap but everybody that's had it has had great
[1524.05] Lee: experiences but this came out on things like instagram good man um here over here at fat
[1529.97] Lee: shark we've been doing a lot of flight testing of bite frost uh we like it a lot better than analog
[1536.37] Lee: unfortunately we've been flying the dji system and we realize that there have some capabilities
[1542.37] Lee: that we now want in our system they raise the bar on what we want fpv to be for that reason
[1548.69] Lee: we're going to delay the launch of bite frost to put in the work to make it even better some
[1553.17] Lee: changes we plan to make include bumping the vtx maximum power from 250 milliwatts to one watt
[1559.41] Lee: include improving the receiver firmware and working on nicer cameras not sure what nicer means
[1564.45] AndyRC: uh odd well well the the original concept was that you'd be using your fpv camera because
[1576.13] AndyRC: your fpv camera has essentially got a better sensor in it than a gopro and uh andrew andrew
[1582.69] Tony: where did you read that if you don't call it man drew that's weird i know i was waiting for frank
[1592.53] Tony: to actually well you know you know that foundry was here first you know that fat shark haven't
[1600.13] AndyRC: developed this system it's a company called hd zero yep and uh so um sorry what was the question
[1609.65] AndyRC: what were you questioning oh yeah so it mentions that um you'd be using your own fpv cam and it's
[1616.29] AndyRC: got a picture of a cad x camera plugged into the hd system uh and so that that's where i got that
[1624.93] AndyRC: from um interesting can you send me the link i'd love to see that yeah yeah yeah um all of these
[1632.53] AndyRC: companies that are coming out uh they're all partnering with this hd zero company um so like
[1639.97] AndyRC: there's another i forget the name but i'm getting sent quite a few of them they're basically all
[1644.61] AndyRC: the same system just rebranded uh this is this is the thing i get i get accused of um being like
[1654.53] AndyRC: a fat shark fanboy i started my skyzone uh review by saying my hdos turned up with see through uh
[1665.65] AndyRC: see through um visors uh after two weeks the regulator went in them uh what was the other
[1674.37] AndyRC: reason they oh yeah and then when i received rapid fire the button was stolen in the wrong place
[1679.41] AndyRC: that's how i started my skybird zone review and i still recommended the fat sharks at the end
[1686.05] AndyRC: and the skyzone fans which there are as many as fat shark absolutely just yeah went chicken
[1694.05] AndyRC: absolutely right anyways let me get you the details that's why you're doing that buddy
[1698.53] Lee: so let me just finish this very quickly so hardware takes a long time to change so we
[1702.13] Lee: expect this to take us several months we plan on providing updates once we have units that we feel
[1706.61] Lee: meet our new expectations thanks again for being awesome pilots and encouraging us yada yada uh it
[1711.49] Lee: was just a little bit of an interesting one because um i personally you know there's there's
[1717.81] Lee: kind of two camps here um you know there's there's um people who are very kind of excited
[1723.81] Lee: about the dgi stuff people who like see this as fat shark you know to put my tongue firmly into
[1730.37] Lee: my cheek as you did and drc is that better for everybody calling no i like i'm true
[1741.65] Lee: this is a democracy so it's ndrc cool okay so um i'll call you and you when i speak to you
[1748.05] Lee: so so that so the whole so so you know lots of people thought that this announcement was just
[1753.49] Lee: to stop people buying the ggi stuff i have been aware and have been talking to fat shark
[1758.69] Lee: a long time under nda about this system so i i know more than i can say but i'm personally
[1765.97] Lee: quite excited about the fact that uh rather than just put out something that's going to be a bit
[1771.09] Lee: sub par and everyone's immediately of course going to compare it to the ggi system uh they've
[1776.05] Lee: actually gone actually you know what we're going to go away and we're going to make this even better
[1779.81] Lee: because competition in any market is a really really good thing and what it will do at the
[1785.89] Lee: moment the dgi stuff is a premium product it's very expensive and if there is more competition
[1791.33] Lee: that drives down price it improves performance having one person within a monopoly position in
[1797.01] Lee: any market is a really really crappy idea so thank you fat shark for going away and you know
[1803.41] Lee: wanting to come out fighting um the other point about this is is that um there's some of the
[1809.89] Lee: information are you flying on the 25 milliwatt setting andrew for your dgi hd system so frank
[1817.73] AndyRC: yeah andi i'll see thank you sorry i'm i was just distracted by the chat sorry that's why i love
[1824.85] AndyRC: tony something's flashing under my name or something what's that about no nothing there i
[1830.45] AndyRC: don't know what you're talking about andy you you're up to something what are you doing nothing
[1836.29] Tony: you are calling frank andy for god's sake this show's going to pot sorry it's all my fault and
[1843.49] Lee: i do apologize for sorry can you can you explain that again because what power level have you got
[1850.13] Lee: you okay have you got the hd system there the as in the gi hd system i have yes cool what power
[1858.61] Lee: level are you running on for ce compliance um that it's it's there isn't one though it's one
[1865.89] Lee: what isn't isn't it no no no it's 25 milliwatts if it's if it isn't frequency hopping if it's
[1871.09] AndyRC: digital no no that that is for digital really so i'm yeah so i'm working with dji and the hope is
[1878.45] AndyRC: that by the time it's available in the uk you see the whole 25 milliwatt thing is for analog
[1888.61] AndyRC: yeah which is why phantoms and mavics have been allowed to fly well not allowed to fly but can
[1896.93] AndyRC: fly you know like four kilometers away or whatever because it's digital and there's a i think there's
[1904.61] AndyRC: a blurred line between with this new digital fpv system um the one that i've got uh is a special
[1914.85] AndyRC: one that is completely unlocked um so so it's still it's still to be decided i think
[1924.21] AndyRC: next week we'll have an answer but i've got i have to be careful here think about it
[1936.37] Curry: last week and the the the offcom 25 milliwatt thing was done about it was quite specifically
[1941.81] Curry: actually the the offcom thing is for analog tv broadcast from the air is 25 milliwatts you can
[1949.65] Curry: actually broadcast from the ground at 500 milliwatts if you've got the correct um license you need a
[1956.69] Lee: license for it because ham only covers ground-based transmissions yeah but the the deal with in our
[1964.45] Curry: uh admittedly uh limited understanding because no one's read through it again
[1971.01] Curry: is to say actually digital tv transmissions is essentially a proprietary wi-fi link and on those
[1977.97] Curry: there probably is something to do with what you're allowed to like put out your router and stuff
[1982.13] Curry: but it is different from an analog tv signal hence uh nobody thinks they're breaking the law by doing
[1988.29] Lee: above 25 milliwatts i think i think one more license right okay so so hang on so so what we
[1995.81] Lee: are really nicely demonstrating is this is confusing and no one's clear on what it is
[2002.93] Lee: however the the the fcc so for the for the the engineers that i'm spoken to who are working
[2010.61] Lee: on the bikefrost system uh they have looked into it and uh the fcc has a has a higher power level
[2018.13] Lee: for the way that these kind of systems work than what they think the ce would the ce mart will be
[2025.89] Lee: able to room at um so so so for me um i'm kind of interested you know to see over the next couple
[2032.37] Lee: of weeks andy if there is going to be any clarity because i would love to know about that because
[2036.77] Lee: i don't want to buy um a thousand pound system myself for h to try hd berry miner did all the
[2043.73] Lee: connect stuff you know i was there i've got the t-shirt i've still got the quad um and and haven't
[2050.37] Lee: you know just over i think the 25 milliwatts would give you 0.7 kilometers range on the ggi
[2056.53] Lee: system um you know i i would be a little bit sad if i spent a grand and got and got over a kilometer
[2063.57] AndyRC: well well let me let me clear something up that is for sure because uh your good self
[2070.37] AndyRC: i can because i watch your channel i know that you only fly at 25 milliwatts you're probably
[2076.53] AndyRC: the only person in the uk flying at 25 milliwatt right well well yeah well yeah you have to be
[2084.61] Lee: careful on youtube though don't you because there's always going to be one uh yeah do you
[2089.41] AndyRC: know what i i don't think i don't think that off offcom or whatever or all of these regulate
[2096.85] AndyRC: i don't think they really care that much how much we're outputting it's more about the the safety
[2103.73] AndyRC: of it you know there's no i mean if you think about it um you can set your model to
[2112.53] AndyRC: pit mode when you disarm so like you know if p if pc plot or offcom comes along with his
[2119.89] AndyRC: meter and says what are you outputting on that well plug it in one milliwatt says here okay
[2127.33] Lee: while i'm while andrew's just talking about things that are potentially not it not
[2133.57] Lee: 20 minutes tony shut up can we read the uh can we read the disclaimer before i just realize
[2140.45] Curry: we haven't read the disclaimer and ndrc is already incriminating himself about how to get
[2145.57] Curry: away with doing bad things any views expressed by any guests but mainly ndrc on this show a personal
[2152.21] Curry: and may not reflect the views of host or any participant on the show oh oh don't wane you only
[2156.77] Curry: run at 25 milliwatts do you wane yes i do and he stopped talking i'll wait sometimes i run at 10
[2164.93] Curry: milliwatts just to be especially safe because unlike you people murdering people with my
[2174.45] AndyRC: huge power output okay for for all of the sensible people who who uh you know do what do what
[2182.21] AndyRC: nine to nine point nine percent of the people are doing in fpv what i can say is that um it would
[2190.69] AndyRC: be in dji's interest that it can be unlocked and that is the case you will always be able to
[2198.21] Lee: unlock it for potential um so right okay can i i i would seriously question that only because
[2207.81] Lee: thinking about the stuff that happened to tbs and others with the crossfire power levels
[2212.93] Lee: uh you know they had to introduce firmware that had a ce um and other settings now there is the
[2218.61] Lee: konami code for those of you that know what that is that you can then uh then you can unlock it via
[2224.53] Lee: a secret back door which isn't so secret but but you know i think we i think andrew we have to be
[2229.65] Lee: sorry andi rc for tony's benefit we have to we have to be really careful about making blanket
[2236.29] Lee: statements like that when it's legislation that's actually going to dictate what is and isn't legal
[2240.69] Lee: um because because i think you know until until there's clarity about this i mean i'm still trying
[2245.57] Lee: to chase down um frank to have a chat with him about the update on uk drone law um everything
[2251.09] Lee: is so bloody fluid um you know i i i just personally i would love to maybe we'll get
[2258.13] Lee: together and you can show me the dji system because i'd love to see it but until i know
[2262.45] Lee: i can fly more than half a kilometer away i ain't going to spend the money is my is my point of
[2268.61] Curry: course not that you would fly half a kilometer away you just don't want to go in bad if you
[2273.01] Curry: very very good
[2275.73] Tony: absolutely how would you do that on even 25 milliwatt with a 10 turn helical yeah absolutely
[2283.57] AndyRC: and then he's got a job he's he's got like judger or bank quite close to him so he's probably tough
[2289.41] Tony: tuck it into that so what's the stuff that i read about um digital digital
[2297.17] Tony: being you'd be able to do one watt license free that i've read digital the dji system does 700
[2305.33] Tony: milliwatt doesn't do one watt yeah i've read that in the uk you can do one watt on digital license
[2312.85] Tony: free where did you read it i don't know i can find it and send it to you the the definition
[2320.21] SPEAKER_03: of digital um so for example with with wi-fi type applications where there's a lot of the um sort of
[2327.25] SPEAKER_03: listen to full talk and that kind of thing going on and frequency hopping and all that kind of
[2331.33] SPEAKER_03: clever stuff that means that it doesn't uh have as much risk of colliding with something else that's
[2337.09] SPEAKER_03: using the airwaves um and there is a higher power output but i'm not sure that the you know what
[2345.97] SPEAKER_03: we need for uh the low latency hd systems is actually going to manage that so you know with
[2353.97] SPEAKER_03: the the dji thing i think that's probably not quite digital enough to get around that power
[2360.29] SPEAKER_03: limit um but that's for people who know more about this stuff than i do and that and that
[2366.21] Lee: and frank that's my understanding at the moment with the implementation that they have but dji
[2370.85] Lee: have the resources um potentially to change the way that the protocol works the way the radio
[2376.93] Lee: frequencies are worked to comply with these other things uh at the moment i've not seen anything
[2381.41] Lee: definitive from anyone that that i trust enough to you know um to not get arrested for um that
[2388.21] Lee: actually says that's the case and i just wonder if anyone ever finds anything like about that can
[2392.93] Tony: they let me know i'm gonna send something to you in a minute so i've read so like i was having a
[2400.93] Jack: conversation with you playing this and i had me old tin full hat on and we were we were talking
[2407.49] Jack: about if anyone who's ever cracked open a you know phantom three phantom four they've got little
[2415.97] Jack: mini sd cards and then have a little black box and it talks to the mother ship uh whether that
[2424.13] Jack: be china or dji but we we were expressing concerns about you know like how much information
[2433.17] Jack: that uh a dji only market say the dji released really good uh hd fpv and they have a monopoly
[2448.37] Jack: it's not viable for anyone else to get in skyzone fat shark everyone switches over to dji and they're
[2455.25] Jack: harvesting data on us and i'm just you know it's chapped painless and i was like it's like um
[2464.13] Jack: it's like tesla you know tesla is doing a lot of you know they've got like nvidia uh graphics cards
[2472.69] Jack: and like really heavy processing chips inside their vehicles that's you know collecting data on
[2480.05] Jack: self-driving but there's a lot of stored data in there and we're just wondering what you know
[2486.69] Jack: like people for insurance purposes of getting black boxes installed in their car for cheaper
[2491.89] Jack: car insurance and then how long before that's sort of got like some sort of government
[2498.69] Jack: uh probably already has you know that like mediation where uh is mediation the right word
[2507.09] Jack: oh they're looking for like middleman so that if you were to speed the car would print you off
[2512.29] Curry: your ticket kind of like drudge dread in force no wrong wrong stolen movie you're thinking of um
[2522.85] Jack: what what am i thinking of demolition man demolition man is that it where they bring
[2527.57] Jack: him back and he starts swearing and he uses that toilet paper yeah oh yeah that's right
[2532.77] Curry: man i haven't seen that film in years that's awesome the other thing would be as um i don't
[2539.41] Curry: know if anybody gets incredibly frustrated when you get to a motorway and it's like there's road
[2545.65] Curry: work so it says this is an average speed check and so you have to literally do 50 miles an hour
[2551.73] Curry: you can't just like go a bit faster when the cameras aren't there how long before the vehicle
[2557.17] Curry: says actually this road is a 70 limit and i'm going to limit you to this and this is a 50 limit
[2562.37] Curry: i'm going to limit you to that because essentially that's what they seem to be trying to do with
[2567.01] Jack: drones coming up in the the next year's thing well 40 miles an hour if i'm correct frank told
[2573.81] Jack: me that that is the speed of a mavic is that right 42 you know how to get around that average
[2581.73] Jack: speed thing by the way on the motorway we do not endorse
[2589.25] Jack: may or may not be true can you read a heavy disclaimer please curry don't listen to anything
[2596.61] Curry: andy arcy's thirties not with us he's just some random person that wandered into the street
[2601.25] Jack: he shows up every week yeah continue speaking andy arcy won't think you switch you switch lanes
[2609.09] AndyRC: because it doesn't work anymore what that doesn't work that's stupid they well we're on my speeding
[2617.09] Lee: tickets there oh okay thank you yeah stuff at your police thank you
[2629.41] Tony: the post is so slow up north that you're gazing right if it's the up north motorways i expect
[2636.21] Curry: the police are still waiting to get their photos developed at boots perhaps
[2642.13] Jack: oh my god i swear to god if i get an email from them thinking like i'm not north
[2651.73] AndyRC: you can't say anything these days like clearly this is like a fun jokey show and like nothing's
[2659.17] AndyRC: to be taken serious and but people you know that's just the kind of of course i'm not switching lanes
[2674.29] Lee: it's just funny to say that's what this show is about andy arcy yeah you know good recovery
[2681.65] Lee: first of all and second and secondly yeah everyone knows it's funny but there's always one
[2686.69] AndyRC: yes yeah well that one can do whatever they like yeah i agree yeah i agree with your brother um
[2693.73] Jack: so like tesla if you modify tesla or um you recover one from uh you know salvage uh they
[2705.73] Jack: totally do away with your um warranty and um stop you from using tesla fast charging
[2716.29] Jack: and stuff like that and i'm just wondering like painless if you if you can talk about this
[2722.05] Jack: how long before you know dgi's got a record of when you were or were not flying at 25 milliwatts
[2729.97] Jack: and if there's a new module or any modifications they're going to be down with that
[2735.81] Lee: well the thing that we were talking about and and apologies we are wandering into real
[2741.25] Lee: tin foil hat territory here was that if if dgi is collecting that kind of data and they're involved
[2747.89] Lee: in the creation of the legislation for the uk uh what you know could you see an instance where
[2753.57] Lee: a manufacturer like that would say well hang on a minute because we can prove or we could lock
[2757.81] Lee: or monitor our users to make sure that they don't breach any of these legislations or laws
[2762.61] Lee: that we're putting together can we have some concessions because we can make sure that never
[2767.01] Lee: happens um so maybe you can use a higher power level or whatever it is but does that mean then
[2771.73] Lee: that somebody could you know that the authorities could access those logs as part of an investigation
[2778.37] Lee: to you or you're flying and see that you were in Stafford or Stoke or whatever on that day
[2783.49] Lee: flying above the legal power level for more than 15 minutes at a time that's the thing that i
[2788.21] Lee: that that we were talking about and and you know that that um the dgi hd system is amazing it's
[2795.89] Lee: absolutely fantastic even in this first iteration it is uh i've i've had some engineers describe
[2802.13] Lee: it to me as doing magic stuff that's how impressive you had it have you had a look at it lee i've not
[2809.41] Lee: not i've not had my hands on it but i've done i've done lots of reading up and through the
[2813.33] Lee: bite frost stuff as well um and it's the which is why if you've got it i'd love to actually get my
[2818.13] AndyRC: pause on it but um andy i showed it to andy what was what was your thoughts about it it is very
[2825.01] SPEAKER_03: very cool it is it was i mean i mean it wasn't flying the one you had at that time was it so
[2836.13] SPEAKER_03: so it wasn't very far away but it was i mean it was right next to it it was already kind of bit
[2841.49] SPEAKER_03: crunching around the side so i don't know whether that was too close so what was going on but
[2845.97] AndyRC: there was that's that's better that's because it was in 25 milliwatt mode yeah but it was like
[2851.49] Lee: next to it you didn't get the point seven kilometers is that what you're saying on the
[2860.13] SPEAKER_03: 25 milliwatt i'm not saying nothing till next week it was still i would have loved to have flown
[2868.45] AndyRC: around some of the bandes using that just to explore i'm not so crazy freestyle or anything
[2875.17] SPEAKER_03: just to kind of mosey on some of the holes and gaps and things that have been quite fun
[2880.77] AndyRC: well uh some something that uh no one's talking about is but but i think actually i think people
[2887.73] AndyRC: kind of assumed it and it's this there's no secret about it but if you've gone dji's uh store
[2893.65] AndyRC: they've got a fully built like race quad that you can buy off the shelf with the dji system in it
[2901.49] AndyRC: which is what we kind of assumed they were working towards um so yeah i've got that coming next week
[2910.77] AndyRC: and and then hopefully that will be when they talk about more the power thing because there's
[2920.13] AndyRC: no way the system will sell anywhere at 25 milliwatt you know i mean you could fly around a
[2927.09] AndyRC: small field like how i do but people aren't going to spend a well it's not a grand first of all
[2935.01] AndyRC: it's not a grand you don't have you don't need the controller at all so that's uh you need a
[2941.57] AndyRC: controller you need a controller but you've already the people have already got the control
[2947.73] AndyRC: that's the thing people have already got the goggles that's that's what what's upset it you
[2952.13] AndyRC: know and uh well when feedback into like dji i said you know if you really want to i i just
[2961.25] AndyRC: basically said like look we're all a bunch of cheapskates which is you know it's i'm sorry but
[2968.45] AndyRC: that is just fact we're all a bunch of cheapskates so the mistake that was made is having to have
[2976.45] AndyRC: these goggles even though the goggles are just nuts and they're they're amazing um it's like uh
[2985.17] Jack: the only way i can describe is like top gun and tron had a baby they're actually see
[2992.45] AndyRC: and ant man was in their mix somewhere it's kind of funny because people people say are
[2999.49] AndyRC: you know fat sharks they need more ipd adjustment i can't see and then the only way to do that is
[3005.81] AndyRC: to make them bigger and then when dji actually makes them the right size for everyone you can
[3011.41] AndyRC: even wear glasses over and people go oh they're far too big i'm getting lightly can it's like
[3016.93] Tony: you can't win no one can win you know well to be fair they're right that as well if we're only
[3023.41] Tony: going to be flying 25 milliwatt the the antennas on there they're going to be able to be upgraded
[3029.65] Tony: by the likes of menis rc and things like that aren't they soon so i'd like to point out left
[3036.13] Jack: hand i was right kiss right weren't you weren't you jess tony flies it brad is flies it and left
[3047.65] Tony: hand antennas did i once i made the only reason i fly kiss now look at me he's stroking that doug
[3055.65] Tony: like he's like an evil genius genius and tony in the same tenants i'd just like to
[3065.89] SPEAKER_03: yeah i'll let you have that one jack so i think it's time to wrap up the show jack
[3075.01] Jack: painless it was wonderful having you on my friend i hope it wasn't too painful for you
[3080.21] Jack: not at all painless you could say
[3087.81] Jack: all right uh thank you you've been listening to let's go now sorry about the hiccups we are
[3092.21] AndyRC: working on it we love you don robinson i thought you meant you got a haircut jack and like halfway
[3098.53] Jack: through or something nope uh we've tonight we've been joined by daddy curry kitten goodbye
[3106.69] Jack: jess andrew slash frank with a double personality
[3113.33] Jack: i only heard him say that once uh my little tony the evil genius
[3125.18] Jack: sponsored by fat shark andy rc tata everyone's fame favorite uh resource for nay 32 painless 360
[3136.3] Jack: good night uh i've been bright until i fly thank you very much thanks everyone for tuning in
[3142.14] AndyRC: thank you our patreons and good night hello and you're listening to let's drone out the best drone
[3151.98] AndyRC: based podcast on the internet we would like to thank our patrons including licky dread and also
[3160.22] Jack: art falconer and lastly that's it we've only got two of the four patreons that
[3167.82] Jack: that donate to have their names read out so if you want your name read out
[3176.46] UNKNOWN: go to patreon