=== Let's Drone Out — Episode 262 ===
Title: LDO 262 - Hail Hydra
Recorded: 2020-09-03
Hosts: Jack "Brightontillifly" Nash, Andrew "Frank" Hyams, Wayne "CurryKitten" Andrews, Tony "TheTonstar1" Marchant
Guest(s): Dominic "Mr Cleanflight" Clifton
Total audience: 2,026
Platforms: YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MRpNsvjYL_A); SoundCloud (http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/888157516-letsdroneout-ldo-262-hail-hydra.mp3)
=====================================

Dominic Clifton; https://github.com/hydra
SeriouslyPro; http://seriouslypro.com/

News
Jamming; http://skywise.caa.co.uk/jamming-trial-7-18-sep-salisbury-plain-and-new-forest/

[0.0] Curry: Welcome to Let's Drone Out, the original and best drone themed podcast.
[5.0] Curry: We record the show live on the Thursday night on youtube.com forward slash Let's Drone Out
[10.0] Curry: and our lovely patrons help with the editing costs.
[12.0] Tony: These are...
[13.0] Curry: Wacky Wes
[14.0] Tony: Mikey Dread
[15.0] Tony: Art Faulkner
[17.0] Curry: Carlos Campos
[19.0] Tony: Thank you
[20.0] hydra: Hello and welcome to Let's Drone Out.
[51.94] Jack: Tonight we are joined by the usual everyone's favourite curry kitten.
[56.94] Jack: Hello
[57.94] Jack: My little Tony
[59.94] Jack: Good job
[60.94] Jack: How are you my dear wife are you alright?
[64.94] Jack: Yeah I'm alright
[66.94] Jack: It's good to see you here, we all love you, everyone loves you.
[71.94] Jack: Our guest tonight, Mr Clean Flight slash Dominic Clifton
[76.94] Jack: Hello
[77.94] Jack: AKA the drop down menu SPF3
[82.94] Jack: and if it hasn't got the logo on it then it's a clone and was probably sold to you by Radio C
[88.94] Jack: Banggood, the other one
[91.94] Jack: Yeah Banggood
[93.94] hydra: I wish all those reviews on Banggood are turned into sales for me because that would be lovely but you know
[98.94] hydra: I'm in the B.I.
[100.94] Jack: And the wonderful wizard that's the actual thing controlling us twitching behind the curtain
[106.94] Jack: Andrew slash rank
[108.94] Jack: Good evening
[111.94] Jack: How is it puppet master?
[113.94] Frank: Well you know we started so that's good
[118.94] Curry: I suppose
[120.94] Curry: Your hair has been super styled today Frank I'm just looking at it and it looks like it's blow dried upwards like whoosh
[127.94] Frank: Nice
[128.94] Curry: What's going on there?
[131.22] Frank: Just I think it rained on the way back from the shop today that's all
[138.22] Jack: Right so I'm going to dangerous
[141.22] Jack: I'm dangerously going to share my screen for
[148.22] Jack: Nope it's fine it's fine this works I can enlarge it
[152.22] Jack: If we get kicked off of YouTube
[155.22] Jack: Yeah we know why it's Jack's fault
[157.22] Jack: Completely my fault
[159.22] Jack: So anyway we invited Dominic Clifton on a few weeks ago and this is what happened moments before the show
[165.22] Jack: And Tony I'd like to remind everyone didn't believe this really happened
[170.22] Jack: This is Dominic Clifton paying no attention
[175.22] Jack: So let's just rewind that
[177.22] Frank: Hang on
[178.22] Frank: Is this going to be an hour of this?
[181.22] Jack: Oh dear
[183.22] Jack: And you've got stage shoes on
[185.22] hydra: Yeah and at that point I was like oh I cock it
[189.22] hydra: Not as much as you were
[191.22] hydra: And then ow
[193.22] hydra: Look at the face
[195.22] hydra: Oh really I came down hard
[199.22] Tony: It wasn't the fact I didn't believe him
[201.22] Tony: It was the fact that he took a photo laying on the floor and went
[205.22] Curry: Yeah that's the bit that made us think he's just having a laugh with us
[208.22] Curry: No one takes a photo of themselves on the floor saying I've fallen down and I can't get up
[212.22] Curry: Look here
[213.22] hydra: Yeah that's basically where I was
[215.22] hydra: Yeah on the last floor my girlfriend said don't move because I might have broken something
[219.22] hydra: So we waited for an ambulance
[222.22] hydra: So I stayed on the floor
[225.22] Jack: You were meant to stay on the floor where you fell
[228.22] Jack: Not drag yourself in
[231.22] hydra: I fell over and then I tried to get to the front door
[233.22] hydra: I tried to stand up and I couldn't stand up
[235.22] hydra: And then I got to the front door
[237.22] hydra: And then I felt so faint I actually had to just lie on the doorstep for a few minutes
[241.22] hydra: And recover a little bit
[243.22] hydra: And then eventually I got the keys out of my pocket and crawled in
[246.22] hydra: Stood up again, tried to stand up again
[248.22] hydra: Couldn't, pain was too much
[250.22] hydra: And then got to about the carpet and that's where I was
[253.22] hydra: So about the next two hours while we waited for two ambulances to arrive
[257.22] Curry: Mr. Fruity Fix is not convinced he thinks you're a stuntman
[261.22] Curry: He's saying show ambulance
[263.22] hydra: There is a video of the ambulance
[265.22] hydra: I think I sent it to Jack but I don't know
[267.22] Jack: Yeah I've got it
[269.22] Jack: So if you're listening to this via audio
[273.22] Jack: I'm very sorry
[276.22] Jack: So we're looking at basically your driveway in France is it?
[280.22] Jack: Or Spain
[282.22] Jack: That was it
[283.22] Jack: One of those two
[284.22] Jack: One of them where there's a lot more sunshine and better food
[289.22] Jack: And he stepped over a gap between the car parking space and the wall of the steps and slid
[297.22] Jack: It used to be a rose bed
[299.22] Jack: I took the rose and moved them
[302.22] Jack: Do you think it might be worth putting something back in there?
[305.22] hydra: Do you know there was actually a tree
[307.22] hydra: A little small little pot plant in that corner
[309.22] hydra: And I moved it around the back of the house
[311.22] hydra: And I want to move it back again
[313.22] hydra: So I don't accidentally take the same shortcut again and fall over again
[317.22] hydra: But I can't lift heavy stuff at the moment so I don't want to move it yet
[320.22] hydra: But it will go about there
[321.22] hydra: But long term that is to remove the rose bed
[325.22] Jack: The good idea with the whole rose bed is it's thorny
[329.22] Jack: So that's another deterrent
[333.22] hydra: The irrigation system leaks into the house
[335.22] hydra: So that's the root cause
[339.22] hydra: So I have to get that fixed first
[344.22] Tony: So unlike Drone is Life we've got video footage of accidents and ambulances of our guests
[352.22] Tony: So that don't turn up
[354.22] hydra: There you go
[355.22] hydra: So that's my friend at the top helping me
[357.22] hydra: That's me lining the stretcher with some ambulance people
[361.22] Tony: And then your girlfriend's videoing it off
[364.22] hydra: No she's holding the light up so they can see where they're going
[369.22] Jack: The infrared camera, look at you
[371.22] hydra: One of the ambulance people nearly fell over on a different step while they're carrying me
[377.22] hydra: So yeah
[378.22] Tony: Right so there's your proof everyone
[380.22] Curry: And best suggestion so far is that a rose bush put a ball pit there
[385.22] Curry: That's not a bad idea
[389.22] hydra: We're just playing the ball pit actually
[391.22] Jack: I really really love our comments
[395.22] Jack: Like our little chat
[398.22] Jack: Because not only do we accidentally ignore them
[401.22] Jack: And they have a whale of a time on their own
[403.22] Jack: But they also just generally mock us
[408.22] Jack: And they have also been handing in their horror stories
[416.22] Jack: Yes we've had a few horror stories
[419.22] hydra: Oh are you listening to that episode the other week?
[423.22] Jack: Oh really?
[425.22] hydra: Yeah
[426.22] Frank: Oh my god that was hot
[428.22] Frank: We get in closer and closer to the Halloween episode
[432.22] Frank: Where we're going to be reading out the horror stories
[435.22] Frank: And so people have been sending in their horror stories
[437.22] Frank: To let us drone out at gmail.com
[440.22] Frank: So we're collecting them all together
[443.22] Frank: Jack's given us a little teaser
[446.22] Frank: On the Patreon feed for his horror story
[449.22] Frank: There's a nice collection going together
[451.22] Frank: If anyone else has a near miss
[454.22] Frank: Or some actual hit
[457.22] Frank: Or something that's gone horribly wrong
[460.22] Frank: A fly away anything like that
[462.22] Frank: If you want to anonymously send in your horror story
[468.22] Frank: To let us drone out at gmail.com
[470.22] Frank: We'll collect them together for the Halloween episode
[475.22] Jack: Speaking of horror shows
[477.22] Jack: Next week I will be on Wednesday
[480.22] Jack: From 8pm to 9pm
[482.22] Jack: I'll be interviewed by Drone is Life
[484.22] Jack: I can't be up
[488.22] Tony: Are you going to turn up or fog over or something?
[493.22] Jack: I might chat myself about really
[495.22] Jack: No I'll show up
[497.22] Tony: It's Friday night isn't it?
[499.22] Jack: No it's Wednesday isn't it?
[504.22] Jack: Guys if you can show me some support
[507.22] Jack: And if you can all show up in the chat
[510.22] Jack: I'll post a link somewhere or something
[512.22] Jack: And if you all can just make a mockery
[516.22] Jack: And a ruckus in the old chat
[519.22] Jack: I'd really appreciate it
[521.22] Jack: And ask me some questions
[525.22] Jack: How much jell-o's you think it will hold?
[528.22] Jack: It says MK Lab
[530.22] Jack: Make me lab
[531.22] Jack: Which I like as well
[532.22] Jack: You could fill it with jell-o
[536.56] Jack: The Roseberg
[538.56] hydra: No the idea is to get rid of it
[540.56] hydra: And just make the driveway slightly wider now
[542.56] hydra: That's the better solution
[544.56] hydra: Remove the hole that makes you fall into it
[548.56] Jack: I really don't think that old Shar-Pooh will
[552.56] Jack: Yeah I mean where is Shar-Pooh regards Drone is Life
[555.56] Jack: But I don't think Shar-Pooh will ever do a podcast
[563.56] Jack: He replies with one word answers to my emails
[568.56] Frank: This is a topic for Drone is Life next week surely
[571.56] Frank: Yeah no worries
[573.56] Curry: I'm trying to think what's worse though
[575.56] Curry: You ask Shar-Pooh to turn up and he doesn't
[577.56] Curry: Or you ask him and then Jack shows up instead
[579.56] Curry: And what's worse
[582.56] Curry: But yeah we still had our guest
[585.56] Jack: Yeah Dom how have you been? It's been a while I've missed you
[588.56] Jack: Yeah it's been a while thanks
[591.56] hydra: Yeah it's been an interesting year let's say
[595.56] hydra: Interesting couple of years like
[597.56] hydra: So I did all the H7 stuff maybe a year and a half ago
[601.56] hydra: Which I can't believe it's been a year and a half already
[603.56] hydra: I think that's when it released
[605.56] hydra: And then it was in development for about
[607.56] hydra: At least six months or so before that
[609.56] hydra: So that kept me pretty busy
[611.56] hydra: But I don't think there's been any other H7 FCs since I did mine actually
[615.56] hydra: Which is kind of surprising
[617.56] hydra: So I've been busy doing that and then
[619.56] hydra: Been working on some OSD related stuff for a while
[621.56] hydra: And then obviously all the Flight One stuff
[624.56] hydra: Just before Christmas I think
[626.56] hydra: So I did a bunch of work for them
[628.56] hydra: And yeah the beat of Flight Fall Out recently
[632.56] hydra: That's been interesting
[634.56] hydra: Is that a computer game though?
[638.56] Tony: It looks like Fall Out
[640.56] Tony: Can I start with the drama question then?
[642.56] Tony: Since you've brought it up
[644.56] Jack: We're not that podcast
[648.56] Curry: Yes we are
[650.56] Curry: Whenever I think of Dominic
[652.56] Curry: I instantly think back to
[654.56] Curry: Baseline
[656.56] Curry: And still the specific license terms
[660.56] Curry: That says Dominic can't play there
[662.56] hydra: But it follows you around
[664.56] Curry: Do you know why that came about?
[666.56] Curry: Because Timecop's crazy
[668.56] hydra: No
[670.56] hydra: What actually happened was I wrote
[672.56] hydra: A program called Hydra IRC
[674.56] hydra: Which is an IRC chat client for Windows
[676.56] hydra: And it had a very non-permissive license
[680.56] hydra: It was open source in the terms of
[682.56] hydra: You could see the source
[684.56] hydra: And look at it and contribute bug fixes
[686.56] hydra: And do all this kind of stuff
[688.56] hydra: But it wasn't GPL
[690.56] hydra: So he did a sort of
[692.56] hydra: Piss take of that license
[694.56] hydra: And that's why it was like that
[696.56] hydra: That's the history
[698.56] Curry: But drama seems to follow you
[700.56] Curry: What's happened with beat of Flight and the Fall Out there?
[704.56] Curry: Well yes
[706.56] hydra: For a number of years
[708.56] hydra: For a number of years
[710.56] Jack: Probably about three years or so
[712.56] Jack: Any views expressed
[714.56] Jack: Where's the disclaimer?
[716.56] Tony: We don't have to have a disclaimer for a few
[718.56] Tony: There it is
[720.56] hydra: Thank you Frank
[722.56] Jack: Read it out
[724.56] hydra: I lost mine
[726.56] hydra: Shall I read it out?
[728.56] hydra: I've got to wait until it comes back again
[730.56] hydra: Legal notice
[732.56] hydra: Any views expressed
[734.56] hydra: By any guests, especially me
[736.56] hydra: Very personal indeed
[738.56] hydra: And may not reflect the views
[740.56] hydra: Of others
[742.56] Tony: There you go
[744.56] Tony: You've heard this joke before Don
[746.56] Jack: You've done that perfectly
[748.56] Jack: Why am I even here?
[750.56] hydra: What was I talking about?
[752.56] hydra: Oh yes, that was it
[754.56] hydra: About three years ago
[756.56] hydra: I think it probably was
[758.56] hydra: The sort of atmosphere
[760.56] hydra: Within the sort of beat of Flight
[762.56] hydra: Development sort of members area
[764.56] hydra: I don't know whether you guys know where there's two slacks
[766.56] hydra: Basically there's the public slack
[768.56] hydra: And then there's the private slack
[770.56] hydra: And there was
[772.56] hydra: Sort of growing discontent among
[774.56] hydra: Developers and the attitude
[776.56] hydra: From the primary maintainer
[778.56] hydra: Mike Keller was
[780.56] hydra: Sometimes absolutely
[782.56] hydra: Fine and he does lots of great work
[784.56] hydra: And without him sort of
[786.56] hydra: Beat of Flight wouldn't be going anywhere
[788.56] hydra: Because he does lots of maintenance stuff like I used to do
[790.56] hydra: On the clean flight side of things
[792.56] hydra: But other days you'd catch him
[794.56] hydra: And it would just be like the worst person
[796.56] hydra: In the entire world to try and get anything done or agree with
[798.56] hydra: And the scale sort of
[800.56] hydra: Became, you know, it was like 10%
[802.56] hydra: Of the time you might get
[804.56] hydra: Some bad reaction, then 90%
[806.56] hydra: Of the time it was fine, but it's
[808.56] hydra: Drifted completely the opposite way
[810.56] hydra: Where it got to a point where I just don't
[812.56] hydra: Even want to talk in
[814.56] hydra: This channel because of the negative
[816.56] hydra: Feedback that I know I will receive
[818.56] hydra: No matter what it is that I do
[820.56] hydra: And it ended in the culmination
[822.56] hydra: Of me submitting a bug
[824.56] hydra: Report during a release candidate
[826.56] hydra: Phase, which is the exact
[828.56] hydra: Specific time that you're supposed to
[830.56] hydra: Report bugs to a development
[832.56] hydra: Environment and then
[834.56] hydra: That basically just
[836.56] hydra: Snowboard out of control
[838.56] hydra: And Mike told me in no
[840.56] hydra: One certain terms that
[842.56] hydra: What was the quote? It was something like
[844.56] hydra: Stop talking
[846.56] hydra: To me, I'm done wasting my time
[848.56] hydra: With you
[850.56] hydra: That's what he said, so I'm like fine
[852.56] hydra: So at that point I deleted him from the clean flight
[854.56] hydra: Swag, because I didn't want the
[856.56] hydra: I didn't want his attitude to
[858.56] hydra: Affect the clean flight users
[860.56] hydra: Where he had been very helpful
[862.56] hydra: Over the years
[864.56] hydra: But hadn't been active at all in there
[866.56] hydra: So I'm just like, I don't want this guy talking to me anymore
[868.56] hydra: He doesn't want to waste his time talking to me
[870.56] hydra: I'm not going to waste my time talking to him, so that's fine
[872.56] hydra: The next morning I wake up and he'd also
[874.56] hydra: Deleted me from the beach flight thing
[876.56] hydra: So I'm like, fine
[878.56] hydra: What do I care? And that was that
[880.56] hydra: And I've been happier ever since, it's been great
[882.56] hydra: Absolutely fantastic
[884.56] hydra: And occasionally I submit bug
[886.56] hydra: Reports, because obviously I have a bunch of users
[888.56] hydra: Which use beach flight
[890.56] hydra: So when they have issues and they report them to me
[892.56] hydra: I then report them back to the beach flight development team
[894.56] hydra: But
[896.56] hydra: There was one recently, for an example, there's like a bug
[898.56] hydra: In the configurator where
[900.56] hydra: On one of the H7 boards
[902.56] hydra: If you click Activate MSC
[904.56] hydra: It goes, your flight controller
[906.56] hydra: Hardware doesn't support this
[908.56] hydra: But that's not actually true, it's the software on it
[910.56] hydra: That doesn't support it
[912.56] hydra: So I reported this because the error message is incorrect
[914.56] hydra: And then they have a bot which closes
[916.56] hydra: Issues when they get
[918.56] hydra: When no one replies to them
[920.56] hydra: So MacGyver Gim is the main
[922.56] hydra: Clean flight
[924.56] hydra: Configurator developer
[926.56] hydra: So I just at-mentioned him
[928.56] hydra: And say, have you any thoughts on this
[930.56] hydra: And then I get accused by spamming
[932.56] hydra: And then Mike Kellogg comes on and says
[934.56] hydra: This, that and the other
[936.56] hydra: You're not in good standing with the beach flight community
[938.56] hydra: And I think, which is a load of
[940.56] hydra: Excuse my French, because the only person I'm not really
[942.56] hydra: In a good standing with is him
[944.56] hydra: Not the beach flight community at large
[946.56] hydra: Because most of them appreciate the work that I've done
[948.56] hydra: As far as I understand, at least they tell me that quite frequently
[950.56] hydra: Um, so
[952.56] Jack: If you don't, please email
[954.56] hydra: Hydra
[956.56] hydra: Yeah, no, my email's the rest of the source code
[958.56] hydra: It's fine, you can find it, it's no problem
[960.56] hydra: So yeah, so there's all this drama
[962.56] hydra: So it just became
[964.56] hydra: Just became just intolerable, basically working with them
[966.56] hydra: So I'm just like, I'm happy and not
[968.56] hydra: Not doing any of it at the moment, just doing my own thing
[970.56] hydra: Welcome to the community
[972.56] hydra: World of open source development
[974.56] hydra: And a lot of people think, there's a lot of drama
[976.56] hydra: Around this as well, because it happened shortly
[978.56] hydra: After I'd started work with
[980.56] hydra: Um, with the Flight One guys
[982.56] hydra: As well, so
[984.56] hydra: People were just thinking, oh, it's
[986.56] hydra: Because of Flight One, which is completely untrue
[988.56] hydra: And it had absolutely nothing to do with it
[990.56] hydra: The situation had been brewing for
[992.56] hydra: Like I say, about three years or so
[994.56] hydra: I think, probably
[996.56] hydra: And that had nothing to do with it
[998.56] hydra: So, just to
[1000.56] hydra: Yeah, put a nail in that coffin
[1002.56] hydra: Good to know
[1004.56] Jack: Mike, if you want to come in
[1006.56] Jack: And defend yourself, you can
[1008.56] Jack: You'll have to read out your own
[1010.56] Curry: Disclaimer as well, that's the new rule
[1012.56] Curry: That's it
[1014.56] hydra: You're working to slag each other off
[1016.56] hydra: At the time that I left
[1018.56] hydra: Or was booted out of, should I say
[1020.56] hydra: More appropriately, the Beatify
[1022.56] hydra: Members channel, there was only about two
[1024.56] hydra: Developers sort of
[1026.56] hydra: Actively chatting in there
[1028.56] hydra: Whereas when it initially started, like
[1030.56] hydra: Everyone was in there all the time, like talking
[1032.56] hydra: To each other or suggesting things, you know
[1034.56] hydra: Getting really good feedback and so on, but
[1036.56] hydra: It just came to a point where no one wanted to deal
[1038.56] hydra: With Mike, basically
[1040.56] hydra: And his odd attitude
[1042.56] hydra: At times
[1044.56] hydra: Which is really unfortunate, because
[1046.56] hydra: I want to do, create things and make
[1048.56] hydra: Cool stuff for everybody, but
[1050.56] hydra: What am I supposed to do?
[1052.56] hydra: You know
[1054.56] hydra: It just kills your motivation
[1056.56] hydra: Any kind of desire to
[1058.56] hydra: Want to help improve things is just like
[1060.56] hydra: No
[1062.56] hydra: You have to deal with that, it's just like no
[1064.56] hydra: I don't want to deal with that guy
[1066.56] hydra: So, it's unfortunate
[1068.56] Jack: Is that why you've still got the bug
[1070.56] Jack: Where you can't flash any
[1072.56] Jack: Any like, you know, SPF
[1074.56] Jack: Freeze or anything
[1076.56] Jack: Fails
[1078.56] hydra: Oh, I'm not even aware
[1080.56] hydra: Of that
[1082.56] hydra: Well, nothing
[1084.56] hydra: And I can have a look at your line, but
[1086.56] hydra: You'll probably find it's just the ones not
[1088.56] hydra: Going in DFU mode or something, they haven't got the
[1090.56] hydra: Drivers installed, but I've got a whole bunch
[1092.56] hydra: Of in a box somewhere up there, and I think
[1094.56] hydra: I maybe flashed one quite
[1096.56] hydra: Recently, actually, because someone goes, have you got any old
[1098.56] hydra: Flight controllers, and I've got
[1100.56] hydra: Some custom returns from get FPV that are
[1102.56] hydra: Reconditioned and D-pinned and so on
[1104.56] hydra: And I just sent him a couple of these
[1106.56] hydra: Flashed
[1108.56] Jack: Yeah, I'm having to flash them through
[1110.56] Jack: You know, the DFUS demo
[1112.56] hydra: Yeah
[1114.56] hydra: You have to set the right board rate on them
[1116.56] hydra: Because, yeah, but that's the F3 thing
[1118.56] hydra: Because it was
[1120.56] hydra: It was pretty unique stuff
[1122.56] hydra: Yeah, manual board rate of 256
[1124.56] hydra: 256
[1126.56] hydra: 00
[1128.56] hydra: That's an F3 specific thing
[1130.56] hydra: Nice
[1132.56] Jack: Yeah, maybe, I've probably
[1134.56] Jack: Not the right board rate
[1136.56] Jack: Probably didn't read the manual
[1138.56] Jack: Probably says it's a manual
[1140.56] Jack: I do, I can see it every time
[1142.56] hydra: You never read enough
[1144.56] hydra: You can click, let's be racing F3
[1146.56] hydra: And then click manual and download it, it's probably
[1148.56] hydra: Somewhere in there
[1150.56] Jack: Yeah, but, you know
[1152.56] hydra: It's probably a screenshot of like, clean flight
[1154.56] Jack: Too much hard work
[1156.56] Jack: F3
[1158.56] Jack: Bash, Bash till it works
[1160.56] hydra: Yeah, so yeah
[1162.56] hydra: But you've had the dev drama, yeah
[1164.56] hydra: There's always dev dramas, it seems
[1166.56] hydra: Because, like, do you remember the open pilot
[1168.56] hydra: And tower labs, that was another
[1170.56] hydra: Open toilet
[1172.56] Tony: Yeah, we called it open toilet
[1174.56] Curry: Open toilet, yeah
[1176.56] Jack: Yes, I can read
[1178.56] Curry: Then it was the drone
[1180.56] Curry: I never heard about those, because the boards were so bloody difficult
[1182.56] Curry: To get hold of, it's like, well, I can just
[1184.56] Curry: Dream of the drama of having anything
[1186.56] hydra: Yeah
[1188.56] hydra: Well, clean flight runs on those, so you'd be alright
[1190.56] hydra: Is droneing still a thing?
[1192.56] hydra: I didn't, do you know what, I don't know, I haven't looked
[1194.56] hydra: For a while, but I know that one of the guys
[1196.56] hydra: That was doing that
[1198.56] hydra: Does contribute a lot to
[1200.56] hydra: Beta fly
[1202.56] hydra: In maybe the last
[1204.56] hydra: Uh
[1206.56] hydra: Droning, Droning, isn't it
[1208.56] hydra: Droning, Ninja-y thing
[1210.56] hydra: That was it
[1212.56] hydra: I don't know, I haven't looked on the github thing
[1214.56] hydra: Let's have a look
[1216.56] Jack: Yeah, I was just thinking, you know, try flight
[1218.56] Jack: Went to that
[1220.56] Jack: Code
[1222.56] hydra: Oh yeah, they moved it, didn't they
[1224.56] hydra: No, the last commit was 4th of July
[1226.56] hydra: 2019
[1228.56] hydra: So, no, Droning is dead
[1230.56] Jack: No
[1232.56] Jack: And so were Trigopters
[1234.56] Jack: We got loads of questions
[1236.56] Tony: Can you answer this one?
[1238.56] Tony: Dawn Green
[1240.56] Tony: Green Patches has asked
[1242.56] Frank: What would be the best version
[1244.56] Frank: Of clean flight to run on the SP Racing F4
[1246.56] Frank: Evo slash OSD
[1248.56] Frank: I've had one, I've been meaning to put in a
[1250.56] Frank: Quad for a year or two
[1252.56] Frank: Still in the handwritten envelope from Dominic
[1254.56] Frank: Oh, brilliant, lovely
[1256.56] hydra: Um
[1258.56] hydra: I'd probably
[1260.56] hydra: Compile the latest version of beta flight
[1262.56] hydra: And flash it
[1264.56] hydra: On both, because if you got the double stack thing
[1266.56] hydra: Because the OSD thing was a separate thing to the Evo
[1268.56] hydra: I think you need to leave
[1270.56] hydra: The latest version of clean flight that you can get
[1272.56] hydra: For the OSD board
[1274.56] hydra: And the
[1276.56] hydra: Probably
[1278.56] hydra: Yeah, probably the latest version of beta flight
[1280.56] hydra: But you'll have to compile it from source
[1282.56] hydra: For it, if it still compiles
[1284.56] hydra: Otherwise, just go back through the history
[1286.56] hydra: Of clean flight or beta flight
[1288.56] hydra: Until you find one that compiles and runs on it, really
[1290.56] hydra: But I haven't got a specific version
[1292.56] hydra: Number in mind
[1294.56] hydra: Having to compile it yourself
[1297.84] Jack: Having to compile it yourself
[1299.84] hydra: Yeah
[1301.84] hydra: What is this?
[1303.84] hydra: Because the issue was with beta flight
[1305.84] hydra: They didn't support the OSD slave board
[1307.84] hydra: Which is what the OSD board was
[1309.84] hydra: So you know like this new FrSky OSD
[1311.84] hydra: That's on the Matex 722
[1313.84] hydra: Yeah
[1315.84] hydra: It has a separate little computer
[1317.84] hydra: On there, which is an
[1319.84] hydra: STM L4 processor
[1321.84] hydra: Which basically does all the OSD stuff
[1323.84] hydra: And it does all the pixel stuff
[1325.84] hydra: You've got communication interface between
[1327.84] hydra: An L4 processor and your flight controller
[1329.84] hydra: And they talk to each other
[1331.84] hydra: Basically, this is what I did in
[1333.84] hydra: 2015, I think it was
[1335.84] hydra: But the OSD
[1337.84] hydra: Was using a Mac 7456 chip
[1339.84] hydra: But it still had
[1341.84] hydra: Two CPUs talking to each other
[1343.84] hydra: Via a UART link
[1345.84] hydra: So this was the same thing
[1347.84] hydra: So this was basically going to be stage 1
[1349.84] hydra: Stage 2 was then going to be the pixel OSD stuff
[1351.84] hydra: Which was going to be on a separate board
[1353.84] hydra: Much like the FrSky stuff
[1355.84] hydra: Currently is now
[1357.84] hydra: So that was the process, but then what happened was
[1359.84] hydra: That the someone, I think it was
[1361.84] hydra: Jay Fliper, I think it was
[1363.84] hydra: One of the beatflight devs, ported minimum OSD
[1365.84] hydra: Into the inside of
[1367.84] hydra: Beta flight core
[1369.84] hydra: And then added the Mac 7456 chip
[1371.84] hydra: Driver inside beta flight core
[1373.84] hydra: But brought with it all the
[1375.84] hydra: Horrible OSD code
[1377.84] hydra: Which I've been trying to get rid of, and I had this
[1379.84] hydra: Really nice sort of like element system
[1381.84] hydra: Data source provider, and you had
[1383.84] hydra: An element, and you
[1385.84] hydra: Could have
[1387.84] hydra: A data source which could be like the temperature
[1389.84] hydra: And it could come from different places, but the
[1391.84] hydra: Actual way they display the temperature, no matter
[1393.84] hydra: What kind of temperature it is, never really changes
[1395.84] hydra: Right, and it's the same with loads of other things
[1397.84] hydra: So I had this lovely separation of concerns
[1399.84] hydra: All the unit tests and all this kind of stuff
[1401.84] hydra: And that basically all got thrown away
[1403.84] hydra: When I
[1405.84] hydra: Rebased on the latest version of beta flight
[1407.84] hydra: And maybe a year or so later
[1409.84] hydra: So that was unfortunate, but
[1411.84] hydra: Yeah
[1413.84] Jack: So isn't that stuff
[1415.84] Jack: Oh, sorry
[1417.84] Frank: I was just going to say, so
[1419.84] Frank: So is clean flight now
[1421.84] Frank: Almost a fork
[1423.84] Frank: Of beta flight in a way
[1425.84] hydra: Uh, well
[1427.84] hydra: Sort of yes, sort of no
[1429.84] hydra: So you could call them
[1431.84] hydra: One and the same if you really wanted to
[1433.84] hydra: Because, you know,
[1435.84] hydra: You could all say they're all a fork of
[1437.84] hydra: Multi-wee still
[1439.84] hydra: Essentially, because they are
[1441.84] hydra: But not really a fork of multi-wee
[1443.84] hydra: Because it was a port of multi-wee
[1445.84] hydra: So that's more technically correct
[1447.84] hydra: So they're all essentially a fork
[1449.84] hydra: Of base flight, which is
[1451.84] hydra: Timecop's hard work
[1453.84] hydra: Which we will be forever grateful for
[1457.84] hydra: Did you just vomit in your mouth
[1459.84] hydra: Sorry
[1461.84] hydra: Most people did really great work
[1463.84] Frank: Okay
[1465.84] Frank: And that was the work of moving
[1467.84] Frank: From an 8-bit to a 32-bit
[1469.84] Frank: Yep
[1471.84] hydra: So the main bulk of that code
[1473.84] hydra: Was writing a driver layer
[1475.84] hydra: For the STM
[1477.84] hydra: Processes instead of the Arduino
[1479.84] hydra: Processes that were used at the time
[1481.84] hydra: And then the rest of the code sort of remained
[1483.84] hydra: 8-bit and eventually it got 32-bitified
[1485.84] hydra: And then it got FPU-ified
[1487.84] hydra: Because the F1 processor
[1489.84] hydra: Didn't have an FPU, so there wasn't much use of float
[1491.84] hydra: It was all integer-based math
[1493.84] hydra: And then I did the F3 stuff
[1495.84] hydra: And that's when
[1497.84] hydra: Things really sort of took off quite a lot
[1499.84] hydra: Because now we had a much better way of
[1501.84] hydra: Basically doing math, basically
[1503.84] hydra: Much less processor-intensive
[1505.84] hydra: Way of doing all the math side of things
[1507.84] hydra: Because it was done in hardware
[1509.84] hydra: By the MCU
[1511.84] hydra: And then the BeatFlight stuff
[1513.84] hydra: Came along
[1515.84] hydra: Going back to your sort of fork in question
[1517.84] hydra: And then I
[1519.84] hydra: Essentially rebased CleanFlight
[1521.84] hydra: On the latest version of BeatFlight
[1523.84] hydra: Which was 2.0
[1525.84] hydra: Maybe 3.5 or something like that
[1527.84] hydra: Which was claimed CleanFlight 2.5
[1529.84] hydra: And I did the same thing again recently
[1531.84] hydra: And BeatFlight and CleanFlight
[1533.84] hydra: Are pretty much identical
[1535.84] hydra: I think BeatFlight is up to 4.22
[1537.84] hydra: I haven't merged those changes into
[1539.84] hydra: CleanFlight which is on 4.2
[1541.84] hydra: But they fly and run identically
[1546.08] hydra: So you talked a bit about
[1548.08] hydra: The others not
[1550.08] hydra: One matches my t-shirt
[1552.08] hydra: I do like them t-shirts
[1554.08] Tony: And the other one
[1556.08] hydra: It doesn't
[1558.08] hydra: So I don't like flying it
[1560.08] hydra: It doesn't match my t-shirt
[1562.08] Frank: So is CleanFlight now more kind of a
[1564.08] Frank: Long-term support version
[1566.08] hydra: Well, yeah
[1568.08] hydra: I mean, so
[1570.08] hydra: Going back to the developer
[1572.08] hydra: Discontent
[1574.08] Jack: Of BeatFlight
[1576.08] Jack: No, well
[1578.08] hydra: It's an ongoing theme, it's never going to go
[1580.08] hydra: Anywhere because there is still, and there always will be
[1582.08] hydra: Why Mike Keller is the maintainer of BeatFlight
[1584.08] hydra: A developer Discontent
[1586.08] hydra: That is the situation
[1588.08] Jack: Can't you just go into iNav and cause
[1590.08] hydra: Less trouble?
[1592.08] hydra: I've done a bunch of work for iNav recently
[1594.08] hydra: I helped out with the H7 stuff that got merged in
[1596.08] hydra: A bit ago, but Constantine's
[1598.08] hydra: Very busy with lots of other different things
[1600.08] hydra: But the H7 stuff is coming along
[1602.08] hydra: So I'm going to be helping that out and making the
[1604.08] hydra: Targets work on that
[1606.08] hydra: But going back to
[1608.08] hydra: Where CleanFlight could go
[1610.08] hydra: And what it has
[1612.08] hydra: For the future
[1614.08] hydra: I've had a few ideas, I'd love to
[1616.08] hydra: Bring it back
[1618.08] hydra: And there's been a couple of developers that have contacted me
[1620.08] hydra: Because they don't like
[1622.08] hydra: The, I mean, just
[1624.08] hydra: Butterfly, for instance, those guys
[1626.08] hydra: They don't like the BeatFlight guys
[1628.08] hydra: MU Flight, they don't so much like the
[1630.08] hydra: BeatFlight guys, there's quite a lot of people that don't like
[1632.08] hydra: The main lead developers
[1634.08] hydra: It turns out, let's see
[1636.08] hydra: All the brain FPV guys
[1638.08] hydra: They don't like them
[1640.08] hydra: Yeah, pretty much no one really
[1642.08] hydra: Likes contributing to BeatFlight
[1644.08] hydra: But if you want your code integrated
[1646.08] hydra: That's who you've got to deal with and you've got to
[1648.08] hydra: Tuck it up, unfortunately
[1650.08] hydra: And one day you might get treated well
[1652.08] hydra: Another day, you might get the
[1654.08] hydra: Hammer thrown at you
[1656.08] hydra: So there's a lot of discontent in the community
[1658.08] hydra: Which is unfortunate because
[1660.08] hydra: I think it's stifled
[1662.08] hydra: It's stifled
[1664.08] hydra: Innovation quite a lot, so various
[1666.08] hydra: People from different manufacturers have contacted me
[1668.08] hydra: And said, can you write some code to
[1670.08] hydra: Support this new thing? So
[1672.08] hydra: Tony Cake, for instance,
[1674.08] hydra: Asked me about adding
[1676.08] hydra: Support for the Ghost protocol, but I'm like
[1678.08] hydra: Well, with the whole thing with
[1680.08] hydra: The BeatFlight guys at the
[1682.08] hydra: Moment, I don't think anything
[1684.08] hydra: I do get accepted by anybody
[1686.08] hydra: So
[1688.08] hydra: Probably not a good idea
[1690.08] hydra: Why don't you just change my name?
[1692.08] hydra: Why don't you just change my name, yeah
[1694.08] Tony: Talking of names, there's a question
[1696.08] Tony: Somewhere
[1698.08] Tony: Where was it?
[1700.08] Tony: Hydra
[1702.08] hydra: You probably answered it
[1704.08] hydra: It just came from, I think when I was about
[1706.08] hydra: Maybe 10 or so, using like a
[1708.08] hydra: BBC Micro at school, and everyone wanted to
[1710.08] hydra: Come up with nicknames, the login names and so on
[1712.08] hydra: For themselves, and I opened up a dictionary
[1714.08] hydra: And I was flicking through
[1716.08] hydra: As you do when you're like 10 or whatever
[1718.08] hydra: And I'm like, Hydra, what does it mean?
[1720.08] hydra: Multi-headed, mythical
[1722.08] hydra: Greased, which is hard to kill
[1724.08] hydra: With like serpent heads and stuff
[1726.08] hydra: Or a
[1728.08] hydra: Aquatic little organism that lives
[1730.08] hydra: At the bottom of a pond, so I like
[1732.08] hydra: That stuff
[1734.08] Curry: There you go
[1736.08] Curry: So I have a question
[1738.08] Curry: About the processes, because it went
[1740.08] Curry: F1, F3, F4, F7
[1742.08] Curry: Why H7?
[1744.08] Curry: What's H7 do that
[1746.08] Curry: F7 can't, and what happened to G?
[1748.08] hydra: Okay, so
[1750.08] hydra: H7 is amazing
[1752.08] hydra: It's total amazeballs
[1754.08] hydra: It's got a DMA mux on it
[1756.08] hydra: Which is one of the really cool things about it
[1758.08] hydra: Which basically is, you can just
[1760.08] hydra: You can rework all your DMA streams
[1762.08] hydra: Independently of everything else
[1764.08] hydra: Whereas on the older processors, they're all
[1766.08] hydra: Tied to doing one specific thing
[1768.08] hydra: So it's much more flexible in terms
[1770.08] hydra: Of how you make the data
[1772.08] hydra: Flow around the processor internally
[1774.08] hydra: It's probably
[1776.08] hydra: A layman's way of describing
[1778.08] hydra: The DMA mux
[1780.08] hydra: That's one of its key features
[1782.08] hydra: The G series also has the same
[1784.08] hydra: DMA mux, which is also very cool
[1786.08] hydra: The H7, the one that I use
[1788.08] hydra: The 750 has
[1790.08] hydra: Very little in terms of
[1792.08] hydra: Internal flash memory
[1794.08] hydra: It has about the same as what we used
[1796.08] hydra: For the F1, which is 128K
[1798.08] hydra: When everything used to fit, you know, you can fit
[1800.08] hydra: Baseline in 128K, it was great
[1802.08] hydra: I think it actually fitted on the 64K one, the CJMCU
[1804.08] hydra: Which I ported it to
[1806.08] hydra: But these days, that's not enough
[1808.08] hydra: To basically have all the features
[1810.08] hydra: That you need, I think iNav's minimum is like
[1812.08] hydra: 512
[1814.08] hydra: A lot of B2F features get cut out
[1816.08] hydra: If you don't have enough space
[1818.08] hydra: 256 is one of the lower limits
[1820.08] hydra: These days
[1822.08] hydra: But the way around that
[1824.08] hydra: Is to use either A, external memory
[1826.08] hydra: And you run the code from external memory
[1828.08] hydra: Or B, load the code into RAM
[1830.08] hydra: Because the H7 has got loads of RAM
[1832.08] hydra: So the way I took is basically
[1834.08] hydra: You get an external chip and you load it into RAM
[1836.08] hydra: And you run it from RAM, and it turns out
[1838.08] hydra: It's really fast when you do that as well
[1840.08] hydra: So
[1842.08] hydra: That is one of the core differences
[1844.08] hydra: Between the H processors
[1846.08] hydra: The 8750 and the previous ones
[1848.08] hydra: The other main thing is that
[1850.08] hydra: It's over twice as fast
[1852.08] hydra: It runs at 480MHz, the new ones do
[1854.08] hydra: Instead of like 214 or something
[1856.08] hydra: Where the F7s do
[1858.08] hydra: Which means you've got loads of room to do cool stuff
[1860.08] hydra: Pixel OSTs and running your flight loop
[1862.08] hydra: And doing all kinds of filters and AI crap
[1864.08] hydra: And whatever you want to do with it
[1866.08] hydra: It's just an amazing processor
[1868.08] hydra: And not only that
[1870.08] hydra: It's cheaper than an F7
[1872.08] hydra: It's cheaper
[1874.08] hydra: It's cheaper
[1876.08] hydra: Why don't you like it?
[1878.08] hydra: Because you've got to write a bootloader
[1880.08] Tony: That's why
[1882.08] Tony: Are we going to need anything on top of this
[1884.08] Tony: In another
[1886.08] Tony: Well, we always said
[1888.08] Tony: We don't need anymore
[1890.08] Tony: And then we always go F4, F5
[1892.08] Tony: And we keep going up
[1894.08] hydra: Well, there are
[1896.08] hydra: I mean, for the future
[1898.08] hydra: I'm probably looking at
[1900.08] hydra: Dual core
[1902.08] hydra: Dual core processors
[1904.08] hydra: Oh my god
[1906.08] hydra: To load some of the work
[1908.08] hydra: Onto a separate CPU
[1910.08] hydra: There's also the whole
[1912.08] hydra: Digital
[1914.08] hydra: FPV side of thing
[1916.08] hydra: Which is making the necessity
[1918.08] hydra: For OSDs in the flight controller
[1920.08] hydra: Redundant because really all the video processing
[1922.08] hydra: Should be done where the
[1924.08] hydra: Memory buffer actually is
[1926.08] hydra: You get a camera and it's got pixels
[1928.08] hydra: In RAM and what they really need
[1930.08] hydra: To do is build an OSD system
[1932.08] hydra: Into the HD digital cameras
[1934.08] hydra: That you can draw anything on
[1936.08] hydra: That's my ideal long term goal
[1938.08] hydra: All this analog OSD stuff
[1940.08] hydra: Is a bit crap really and it's
[1942.08] hydra: Going to be past its day pretty soon to be honest
[1944.08] hydra: But some work
[1946.08] hydra: From the manufacturers needs to happen
[1948.08] hydra: With digital vector OSDs
[1950.08] hydra: Built into the camera systems
[1952.08] hydra: And video systems
[1954.08] hydra: Because why would you want all the digital
[1956.08] hydra: Video processing and all the video signals
[1958.08] hydra: Going anywhere near the flight
[1960.08] hydra: Control stuff, it's just a total waste of time
[1962.08] Frank: This episode was recorded
[1964.08] Frank: In front of a live online audience
[1966.08] Frank: Downloaded and edited to make sense
[1968.08] Frank: When it's played audio only
[1970.08] Frank: Censored to please the iTunes people
[1972.08] Frank: On the internet, forwarded through to your podcast provider
[1974.08] Frank: Downloaded, playing on your device
[1976.08] Frank: And is now playing in your ears
[1978.08] Frank: All thanks to our Patreons
[1980.08] Frank: Consider joining them and you'll also get
[1982.08] Frank: Other online benefits
[1984.08] Frank: Find out more at patreon.com
[1986.08] Frank: Forward slash let's drone out
[1988.08] Jack: So will my quad FC
[1990.08] Jack: Be more powerful than my PC
[1992.08] Jack: I used before 2010?
[1994.08] hydra: Probably yes
[1996.08] Jack: Yeah
[1998.08] hydra: Yeah
[2000.08] hydra: The H7 Pro is amazing
[2002.08] hydra: It has a bunch of other things
[2004.08] hydra: The IO support and it is excellent
[2006.08] hydra: It allows you to connect loads of things to it
[2008.08] hydra: Like I used
[2010.08] hydra: I used SDIO
[2012.08] hydra: For the logging
[2014.08] hydra: So previous to the H7
[2016.08] hydra: Everyone has been using
[2018.08] hydra: It's the
[2020.08] hydra: SDMMC
[2022.08] hydra: Yeah, the old one
[2024.08] hydra: Which is an old interface
[2026.08] hydra: Which is only one bit
[2028.08] hydra: And then you send another bit
[2030.08] hydra: And then you send another bit
[2032.08] hydra: And with the H7 I use a four bit interface
[2034.08] hydra: So it allows you to send four times the amount of data
[2036.08] hydra: So you can fill the SD cards
[2038.08] hydra: Write cache quicker
[2040.08] hydra: And then let the flight controller get back
[2042.08] hydra: To actually doing flight control stuff
[2044.08] hydra: Much quicker
[2046.08] hydra: So basically anything that interferes with
[2048.08] hydra: Getting back to the main core
[2050.08] hydra: Of the flight control loop
[2052.08] hydra: Doing its thing about reading the data
[2054.08] hydra: And then calculating the outputs
[2056.08] hydra: And applying filters and all this kind of stuff
[2058.08] hydra: Just happens to so much quicker on an H7
[2060.08] hydra: And you fly it
[2062.08] hydra: And you're just like oh my god this thing flies amazing
[2064.08] hydra: And I haven't even done anything to it
[2066.08] hydra: It's like I was shocked at how well it flies
[2068.08] hydra: Just on the initial port of it without even tuning a core
[2070.08] hydra: And I'm like this is just
[2072.08] hydra: It's not a daily difference between the F7
[2074.08] hydra: That I had maybe one or two
[2076.08] hydra: Two years before that
[2078.08] hydra: And it's just the processor
[2080.08] hydra: Everything just runs really super smooth
[2082.08] Curry: Mmm
[2084.08] Curry: Okay so I have a possible
[2086.08] Curry: Question about convergence
[2088.08] Curry: As I've been playing recently
[2090.08] Curry: With OpenHD
[2092.08] Curry: Which is a sort of open source
[2094.08] Curry: Digital
[2096.08] Curry: We do it on the Raspberry Prize
[2098.08] Curry: It squirts it down to the other side
[2100.08] Curry: So with the processor getting really fast
[2102.08] Curry: Do you think we'll get to the situation
[2104.08] Curry: Because basically the limiting factor
[2106.08] Curry: In the latency is basically having that
[2108.08] Curry: Hardware encoding 264H265
[2110.08] Curry: Before you basically squirt it down
[2112.08] Curry: To the other side
[2114.08] Curry: Are they getting fast enough to do that
[2116.08] Curry: Fast
[2118.08] Curry: Do you think it's going to
[2120.08] Curry: Sort of the H-type chips
[2122.08] Curry: The hardware in those
[2124.08] Curry: Are we going to come to a point where
[2126.08] Curry: This flight controller
[2128.08] Curry: It can do analog, it can do digital
[2130.08] Curry: Or is that a whole
[2132.08] hydra: We'll have to build it into the camera
[2134.08] hydra: And everything
[2136.08] hydra: They're amazing
[2138.08] hydra: They do 4K digital video recording
[2140.08] hydra: And stuff
[2142.08] Curry: Quad cores aren't they
[2144.08] hydra: Yeah
[2146.08] hydra: Ultra core and things like that
[2148.08] hydra: And they've got built in digital processes
[2150.08] hydra: And all this stuff, yeah
[2152.08] hydra: It'll happen eventually
[2154.08] hydra: Someone's got to push the need for it
[2156.08] hydra: For the manufacturers
[2158.08] hydra: That's where all technology comes from
[2160.08] hydra: Someone says, we need to do this faster
[2162.08] hydra: And then someone will make a product
[2164.08] hydra: Because they can make some money out of selling it
[2166.08] hydra: That's the way it happens
[2168.08] hydra: And just say, no, it's crap
[2170.08] hydra: The latency's terrible
[2172.08] hydra: Some manufacturer will come out and go
[2174.08] hydra: No, I've made a better one, look the latency's great now
[2176.08] hydra: And that's just the way it works
[2178.08] hydra: Right
[2180.08] hydra: So keep pushing for it
[2182.08] hydra: And it will happen
[2184.08] hydra: Don't do anything, don't say anything
[2186.08] hydra: Just go, I wish it could be better
[2188.08] Tony: Who's guess is
[2190.08] Tony: F10
[2192.08] Tony: What date is that going to be?
[2194.08] hydra: We're on height
[2196.08] hydra: Yeah, that was someone that stuck an F3
[2198.08] hydra: And an F7 on the same board
[2200.08] hydra: And called it F10
[2202.08] hydra: It was hilarious
[2204.08] hydra: Great marketing is done
[2206.08] hydra: Brilliant
[2208.08] hydra: I laughed when I saw the name of that
[2210.08] hydra: That's pretty cheeky
[2212.08] Jack: Technically it's dual core
[2214.08] Jack: Yep
[2216.08] hydra: It was
[2218.08] Jack: It's hilarious, do you reckon we'll argue with it?
[2220.08] Jack: We probably will one day, let's face it
[2222.08] Jack: Back in the old days
[2224.08] Jack: Well I mean
[2226.08] hydra: You've got the M series from ST
[2228.08] hydra: Which
[2230.08] hydra: I've not looked at their line-up recently
[2232.08] hydra: But I know that there's one
[2234.08] hydra: Which has like a
[2236.08] hydra: I think it's like an F7
[2238.08] hydra: Core
[2240.08] hydra: And an F4
[2242.08] hydra: Core, sorry, not F4
[2244.08] hydra: Arm
[2246.08] hydra: Cores, it's got
[2248.08] hydra: An older arm core and a newer arm core
[2250.08] hydra: So you can do all the IO, sort of low level
[2252.08] hydra: IO stuff, like your D-Shop processing
[2254.08] hydra: And things like that
[2256.08] hydra: On the IO core, and then have all the complicated
[2258.08] hydra: Math on the better core
[2260.08] hydra: The 7th core
[2262.08] hydra: I think it is
[2264.08] hydra: I'd have to bring one of the data sheets to remind myself of it
[2266.08] hydra: It's been a little while since I looked
[2268.08] hydra: But those are coming down in price, but they're still more expensive
[2270.08] hydra: Than people want to pay for a flight controller
[2272.08] hydra: So, no, I ain't building one yet
[2274.08] hydra: Plus, you know, there's a whole matter of
[2276.08] hydra: Software
[2278.08] hydra: Someone's got to write it
[2280.08] hydra: It's not currently me
[2282.08] Frank: That's kind of the thing
[2284.08] Frank: With the H7, isn't it
[2286.08] Frank: You've built it, and
[2288.08] Frank: They're gradually coming
[2290.08] Frank: And doing various
[2292.08] Frank: Things with it, but there's now
[2294.08] Frank: I think not that long ago
[2296.08] Frank: Only a matter of weeks ago that
[2298.08] Frank: Maytech released an H7 board
[2300.08] hydra: I think
[2302.08] Frank: And what, for B2Flight?
[2304.08] Frank: I think so
[2306.08] hydra: I know they've done a picture walk one
[2308.08] hydra: And the
[2310.08] hydra: RG pilot have had H7 support
[2312.08] hydra: For a while
[2314.08] hydra: But I didn't think Maytech had got
[2316.08] hydra: I mean, I'm out of the loop
[2318.08] hydra: A little bit with some of this stuff
[2320.08] hydra: So I'll apologize in advance for that
[2322.08] hydra: Maytech-sys.com
[2324.08] hydra: In it, yeah
[2326.08] hydra: Oh, they've got, yeah
[2328.08] hydra: That's right, yeah, because
[2330.08] hydra: They've got the Maytech H743
[2332.08] hydra: Wing flight controller, which will be the
[2334.08] hydra: INAB one, so I don't think
[2336.08] hydra: That'll run B2Flight
[2338.08] hydra: Now the reason they've used H743
[2340.08] hydra: Is because they haven't
[2342.08] hydra: Written a bootloader, which allows
[2344.08] hydra: You to use the external flash, so that's
[2346.08] hydra: Why the Maytech H743 is going to be
[2348.08] hydra: Super expensive, because the chip itself
[2350.08] hydra: Is way more expensive than an H750
[2352.08] hydra: But the solution is simpler because it doesn't
[2354.08] hydra: Need a bootloader
[2356.08] hydra: I went the extra mile, wrote a bootloader, and made it
[2358.08] Frank: Cheap
[2360.08] Frank: Well done
[2362.08] Frank: And then the other
[2364.08] Frank: Question, I guess, is
[2366.08] Frank: How long before we throw
[2368.08] Frank: All of these processors away
[2370.08] Frank: And go for FPGAs, how long
[2372.08] Frank: Until that?
[2374.08] hydra: I don't know about that
[2376.08] hydra: There are some interesting things
[2378.08] hydra: In process terms
[2380.08] hydra: Other than what
[2382.08] hydra: ST is doing
[2384.08] hydra: FPGAs, interesting, I've not really
[2386.08] hydra: Not looked too much into that, I know the brain
[2388.08] hydra: FPGAs, I've been mucking them out with FPGAs
[2390.08] hydra: For their OSD stuff
[2392.08] hydra: For a while
[2394.08] hydra: But the other
[2396.08] hydra: Things that's interesting is the risk Vcores
[2398.08] hydra: I was contacted
[2400.08] hydra: A little while ago about
[2402.08] hydra: Porting beta flight, helping port beta flight
[2404.08] hydra: Out to risk Vcore, and that has
[2406.08] hydra: Actually sort of progressed
[2408.08] hydra: And just the other day, the guy emailed me
[2410.08] hydra: And said, you know, this is what
[2412.08] hydra: This is where I'm currently at, I had a look at the
[2414.08] hydra: Code base, I had a look at some
[2416.08] hydra: Of the stuff that they've done, and
[2418.08] hydra: That's pretty interesting, because I don't know whether you know
[2420.08] hydra: About it, but there's a
[2422.08] hydra: Cpu called
[2424.08] hydra: Kendrite K210
[2426.08] hydra: I think, it's really
[2428.08] hydra: Really cheap, if you look at like SEED Studio
[2430.08] hydra: I think it is
[2432.08] hydra: Yeah
[2434.08] hydra: SEED Studio, they do a bunch of really
[2436.08] hydra: Cheap boards
[2438.08] hydra: Which use this processor
[2440.08] hydra: So you can get one of those if you're interested
[2442.08] hydra: And help out with the risk Vporting
[2444.08] hydra: If you're interested in that side of things
[2446.08] hydra: But the thing that's interesting about the K210
[2448.08] hydra: Is that it's got
[2450.08] hydra: Hardware AI, as opposed to
[2452.08] hydra: FPGA for just doing
[2454.08] hydra: Random things that you might want to do in hardware
[2456.08] hydra: I don't think there's that many random
[2458.08] hydra: Things that you want to do in hardware, that the hardware
[2460.08] hydra: Doesn't already do at the moment, at least I can't think of
[2462.08] hydra: Too much off the top of my head
[2464.08] hydra: Because
[2466.08] hydra: FPGAs are good for doing sort of
[2468.08] hydra: Like parallel work
[2472.08] Jack: I worked a lot
[2474.08] Jack: With them on
[2476.08] Jack: The open source scaler
[2478.08] Jack: You know the
[2480.08] Jack: It was an upscaler for
[2482.08] Jack: Metro Video Games
[2484.08] Jack: And all they do is get hot and have grounding
[2486.08] Jack: Issues
[2488.08] Jack: And not to mention they're expensive as well
[2490.08] Jack: They are
[2492.08] Jack: Coke and Haul money, that's all
[2494.08] Jack: They're getting cheaper though
[2496.08] Frank: I just know them as
[2498.08] Frank: As a way of doing
[2500.08] Frank: Things
[2502.08] Frank: You go from loop times to just
[2504.08] Frank: It being pretty much instantaneous
[2506.08] Frank: And you stop thinking about loop times anymore
[2508.08] hydra: Yeah, yeah
[2510.08] hydra: I mean there's, you just sense of
[2512.08] hydra: Feedback and the calculation and then the motor
[2514.08] hydra: Output, you're always going to have
[2516.08] hydra: Something going on there
[2518.08] hydra: I don't know whether
[2520.08] hydra: You're going to be able to do it all in hardware
[2522.08] hydra: I don't know, maybe
[2524.08] hydra: It'll be interesting, I'd love to see someone
[2526.08] hydra: Do it, it'll be cool
[2528.08] Frank: Yeah, it's a challenge for someone
[2530.08] Frank: Yeah, but I think some of the
[2532.08] hydra: AI stuff is kind of interesting as well
[2534.08] hydra: I think
[2536.08] hydra: There's some interesting things
[2538.08] hydra: You can do with regards to filtering, with regards
[2540.08] hydra: To the dynamic filtering
[2542.08] hydra: Side of things and just working it out
[2544.08] hydra: Better using AI
[2546.08] hydra: I think people
[2548.08] hydra: Are working on stuff like that
[2552.08] hydra: Yeah, there's quite a few things you can do
[2554.08] hydra: With it and some image recognition stuff
[2556.08] hydra: Would be interesting as well if you integrated the camera
[2558.08] hydra: Into it as well
[2560.08] Frank: Is the AI stuff that's going on
[2562.08] Frank: At the moment with the boards
[2564.08] Frank: That are currently out there
[2566.08] Frank: Is that mainly about the
[2568.08] Frank: Sort of replacing
[2570.08] Frank: A PID loop, I guess
[2572.08] hydra: Yeah, there's, what was there, I think
[2574.08] hydra: There was a PhD guy somewhere
[2576.08] hydra: In the States, did neuro flight
[2578.08] hydra: Right?
[2580.08] hydra: And I think Joshua
[2582.08] hydra: Barda has also touched on this
[2584.08] hydra: I think I tend to agree with his current analysis
[2586.08] hydra: That in order to teach an AI
[2588.08] hydra: You have to do a lot of stuff repeatedly
[2590.08] hydra: And
[2592.08] hydra: Getting it
[2594.08] hydra: To a point where it's taught
[2596.08] hydra: Is a problem
[2598.08] hydra: And the second problem is
[2600.08] hydra: The situation changes depending on
[2602.08] hydra: The state of your quad
[2604.08] hydra: So maybe you hit a tree and bend the prop
[2606.08] hydra: Now the AI's going, what do I do
[2608.08] hydra: What do I do, I don't know, I haven't encountered this
[2610.08] hydra: Because no one taught me this before
[2612.08] hydra: Maybe your screws come loose
[2614.08] hydra: And it starts vibrating at some kind of weird frequency
[2616.08] hydra: And there's all this kind of stuff
[2618.08] hydra: Which you would have to teach
[2620.08] hydra: The AI about all these different
[2622.08] hydra: Things and I think that is the
[2624.08] hydra: The issue of making it
[2626.08] hydra: Fly by AI
[2628.08] hydra: I think that's one of the hard challenges
[2630.08] hydra: To solve, I'm not saying it's not
[2632.08] hydra: I'm challenging on people who shouldn't try
[2634.08] hydra: But it's a difficult task
[2636.08] hydra: And it's one that's a time consuming
[2638.08] hydra: Task as well because you need sort of
[2640.08] hydra: Either an environment
[2642.08] hydra: Which is, I'm repeating Joshua Barlow
[2644.08] hydra: Here, which is the same
[2646.08] hydra: As what you get in real life which is
[2648.08] hydra: Nigh on impossible to create
[2650.08] hydra: Right, gravity, wind and all that
[2652.08] hydra: Kind of stuff
[2654.08] hydra: Dynamics of
[2656.08] hydra: Wind around a prop and
[2658.08] hydra: Calculated motors to be 100% exact
[2660.08] hydra: That it is in real life
[2662.08] hydra: And then running your code in that
[2664.08] hydra: Simulated environment thousands of times
[2666.08] hydra: No curvature
[2668.08] hydra: No, not going to happen very easily
[2670.08] hydra: So, yeah
[2672.08] hydra: I mean, so
[2674.08] hydra: I think that AI could be used in other
[2676.08] hydra: Areas such as the filtering
[2678.08] hydra: For instance, this is like a really
[2680.08] hydra: Basic thing that you can use it for
[2682.08] hydra: So, you know, like we had this
[2684.08] hydra: Dynamic notch filter thing that was added
[2686.08] hydra: Which turned out to be pretty great
[2688.08] hydra: For reacting
[2690.08] hydra: To changing conditions of your
[2692.08] hydra: Quad, as in the state of decay
[2694.08] hydra: Of all
[2696.08] hydra: Of all of your flying
[2698.08] hydra: Things that you have
[2700.08] hydra: Because they're all pristine and they work perfectly
[2702.08] hydra: When you first get them and then
[2704.08] hydra: They don't fly so well any more
[2706.08] hydra: Then you buy a new one
[2708.08] hydra: Because you can't be bothered to tune it, right?
[2710.08] Tony: That's it
[2712.08] Tony: So having the AI
[2714.08] Tony: Get better at that, yeah
[2716.08] hydra: Here's a question
[2718.08] hydra: I remember changing motor bearings
[2720.08] hydra: When was the last time any of you guys changed a motor bearing?
[2722.08] hydra: Jack was asked about it the other day
[2724.08] Curry: Jack did want to say
[2726.08] Curry: Mine was on my
[2728.08] Curry: Tricopter on my DT750
[2730.08] hydra: I'm shocked
[2732.08] hydra: Yes, Jack
[2734.08] hydra: Yes, I did one, maybe about three weeks
[2736.08] hydra: Again, but only because you can't
[2738.08] hydra: Get the motors anymore and I like that particular
[2740.08] hydra: Quads and I had just the bearings
[2742.08] hydra: Already
[2744.08] hydra: I've got a kit
[2746.08] hydra: And whilst protecting
[2748.08] hydra: The magnets against it
[2750.08] hydra: How did you get the bearing out?
[2752.08] hydra: Was it in the bell
[2754.08] hydra: Or the bottom?
[2756.08] Jack: The bottom, yeah
[2758.08] hydra: It's not too bad
[2760.08] hydra: But if it's in the top part of it
[2762.08] hydra: Yeah
[2764.08] hydra: Then
[2766.08] Jack: Yeah, so the
[2768.08] Jack: The way to get it out of the top
[2770.08] Jack: The stator is find the right size
[2772.08] Jack: That sits in between the stator and the windings
[2774.08] Jack: Yeah
[2776.08] Jack: And you can
[2778.08] Jack: Do what I used to do
[2780.08] Jack: And what you can do
[2782.08] Jack: Is you can run
[2784.08] Jack: The top of the socket
[2786.08] Jack: And take
[2788.08] Jack: The chamfer off it
[2790.08] Jack: With a grinder
[2792.08] Jack: So I've got a set of these sockets
[2794.08] Jack: And I've got a set of flat sockets
[2796.08] Jack: So they're flattened on top
[2798.08] Jack: And they're great for
[2800.08] Jack: Using as cups and smashing things out
[2802.08] Jack: So
[2804.08] Jack: Yeah
[2806.08] Jack: If you can't find your own tools
[2808.08] Jack: Make them yourself
[2810.08] hydra: That's it, making tools is great
[2812.08] hydra: I love making tools
[2814.08] hydra: Investing in tools is never a bad decision
[2816.08] hydra: One of my bandmates
[2818.08] hydra: Said to me once
[2820.08] hydra: I shall not forget his words
[2822.08] Jack: It's um
[2824.08] Jack: Yes, Fabiano Calculator
[2826.08] Jack: Are you hearing this?
[2828.08] Tony: You don't have to answer this question
[2830.08] Tony: From Mr Shady if you don't want to
[2832.08] Tony: How bad have you
[2836.08] Tony: Well, let's put it this way
[2838.08] hydra: I never made another batch
[2840.08] hydra: After some point in time
[2842.08] hydra: I just went
[2844.08] hydra: Nope, that's enough
[2846.08] hydra: Nope, so yeah
[2848.08] hydra: I think if you looked on like
[2850.08] hydra: Aliexpress and Banggood and
[2852.08] hydra: You look at quantity available
[2854.08] hydra: They'll say like 8,000, clearly
[2856.08] hydra: They did a manufacturing run of 8,000 boards
[2858.08] hydra: And I'm like
[2860.08] hydra: No, I can't, you know
[2862.08] hydra: You order 8,000 of something
[2864.08] hydra: The price of the CPUs comes right down
[2866.08] hydra: The price of all the other components comes right down
[2868.08] hydra: All the connectors comes right down and therefore
[2870.08] hydra: Your price is like super cheap
[2872.08] hydra: Um, so there's no way I could compete with that
[2874.08] hydra: Plus you also have to have the upfront investment
[2876.08] hydra: To afford to actually have enough money
[2878.08] hydra: To say, factory, make me
[2880.08] hydra: 8,000 boards and do it now
[2882.08] hydra: They'll go, give me some money then
[2884.08] Tony: Must be well annoying
[2886.08] Tony: Having that happen, I've got a
[2888.08] Tony: Genuine run in my ex-class by the way
[2890.08] hydra: It wasn't
[2892.08] hydra: It was kind of cool
[2894.08] hydra: At the same time as being really annoying
[2896.08] hydra: It was
[2898.08] hydra: Absolutely fantastic, I remember it
[2900.08] hydra: Quite clearly
[2902.08] hydra: The day that
[2904.08] hydra: The thing that I designed in my head
[2906.08] hydra: Turned up from the factory
[2908.08] hydra: That the first prototype
[2910.08] hydra: Of the SP Racing F3 and I'm like
[2912.08] hydra: Oh my god, I made and designed
[2914.08] hydra: This and it's here now, cool
[2916.08] hydra: It was really really cool
[2918.08] hydra: Um, so in one
[2920.08] hydra: Way, having someone else clone it
[2922.08] hydra: Validated that everything I was doing
[2924.08] hydra: Was great
[2926.08] hydra: Except those stupid little connectors
[2928.08] Jack: That were too close to the edges
[2930.08] hydra: No, you see, but everyone's going
[2932.08] hydra: Back to connectors now, everyone loves connectors
[2934.08] Jack: No, no this
[2936.08] hydra: It depends on
[2938.08] hydra: It depends on the connectors
[2940.08] hydra: The ones with the latches that don't break off
[2942.08] hydra: Quite sweetly are good
[2944.08] hydra: Not promised, I um
[2946.08] hydra: One of the SP Racing F3s didn't have
[2948.08] hydra: They f***ed up the
[2950.08] hydra: Solder paste that they used on one batch
[2952.08] hydra: Which is why I had a bunch of returns from GetFPB
[2954.08] hydra: Um, so some of the things came off
[2956.08] hydra: That would be a bit too easily
[2958.08] Jack: The USB
[2960.08] Jack: Rectified, yeah exactly
[2962.08] Jack: At least they didn't get it as wrong
[2964.08] Jack: As the Omnibus F
[2966.08] Jack: Their fours
[2968.08] Jack: They just like, you'd breathe on them
[2970.08] Jack: And they would be like, PING!
[2972.08] hydra: The components that they use
[2974.08] hydra: On the clones is just a nightmare
[2976.08] hydra: To be honest, I'm kind of over talking about clones
[2978.08] hydra: To be honest, but
[2980.08] hydra: But I will say that if you
[2982.08] hydra: Specify a 6 volt
[2984.08] hydra: Capacitor with this rating
[2986.08] hydra: Right, they won't use that
[2988.08] hydra: Or, and plus you have to use a
[2990.08] hydra: Capacitor that's got a higher rating anyway
[2992.08] hydra: Because it derates certain conditions and so on
[2994.08] hydra: So they will use
[2996.08] hydra: The cheapest, crappiest ones
[2998.08] hydra: That they could possibly
[3000.08] hydra: Buy in order to build
[3002.08] hydra: The products that you're buying
[3004.08] hydra: As opposed to someone like me who buys
[3006.08] hydra: Single parts from authorised
[3008.08] hydra: Resellers and proper manufacturers
[3010.08] hydra: Like, you know, my reel
[3012.08] hydra: So the back here for the pick and place machine
[3014.08] hydra: Which, you know, you can see someone on the machine over here
[3016.08] hydra: You know, they're all genuine
[3018.08] hydra: Good stuff from known brands
[3020.08] hydra: Like Kemet and AVX
[3022.08] Tony: As opposed to
[3024.08] Tony: I just don't see why people
[3026.08] Tony: Why do people put such rubbish
[3028.08] Tony: Clones in there, you know
[3030.08] Tony: You're carrying a nice GoPro
[3032.08] Tony: You might be floating over the sea
[3035.08] Jack: Same reason people use remoulded tires
[3037.08] Jack: They don't value their life
[3039.08] Jack: The painless days, I remember
[3041.08] Jack: Chatting about the SPF
[3043.08] Jack: Racing F3
[3045.08] Jack: And
[3046.08] Jack: SPR Racing F3
[3048.08] Jack: And the start of the FC
[3050.08] Jack: Revolution
[3051.08] Jack: Thanks for laying the foundation for the modern hobby
[3054.08] Jack: Yeah
[3055.08] Jack: There you go
[3056.08] hydra: No worries
[3057.08] hydra: I've got one
[3058.08] Tony: From AA here, I asked him to post it again
[3060.08] Tony: So
[3062.08] Tony: Can someone read that out?
[3064.08] hydra: AA asked
[3065.08] hydra: I really should know
[3066.08] hydra: That it's something embarrassing
[3067.08] hydra: I don't, so I'll just ask
[3068.08] hydra: Are you the maker of the Hydra app?
[3070.08] hydra: What's the Hydra app?
[3073.08] Curry: I think that answered the question
[3075.08] Curry: Yeah, I was like
[3077.08] hydra: What is really annoying
[3079.08] hydra: What is really annoying is that
[3080.08] hydra: When people post like
[3082.08] hydra: Snippets of code on like
[3083.08] hydra: GitHub
[3084.08] hydra: From like logs and things like this
[3085.08] hydra: That have at
[3086.08] hydra: And then the word Hydra
[3088.08] hydra: Because what happens to GitHub then
[3089.08] hydra: Doesn't mention on me
[3091.08] hydra: And because the Hydra is quite popular
[3092.08] hydra: I get these random posts from like
[3094.08] hydra: Projects that I've got no involvement
[3096.08] hydra: Or affiliation with
[3097.08] hydra: Like again
[3098.08] hydra: We mentioned that
[3099.08] hydra: Can you please quote the code
[3100.08] hydra: If it contains at Hydra on GitHub
[3103.08] hydra: Just please
[3104.08] hydra: Please quote the code
[3105.08] hydra: Just put the triple quotes
[3106.08] hydra: Triple backticks
[3107.08] hydra: Before and after the thing that you pasted
[3109.08] hydra: And then
[3110.08] hydra: I won't have to
[3111.08] hydra: Unsubscribe from every one of those
[3114.08] Frank: Please please
[3115.08] Frank: To fill in the gap there
[3116.08] Frank: I think
[3117.08] hydra: I don't know the Hydra thing
[3118.08] hydra: I think the Hydra
[3119.08] Frank: I think the Hydra FPV app
[3121.08] Frank: Is a sort of
[3123.08] Frank: For following on
[3125.08] Frank: Racing
[3126.08] Frank: Watching the racing feeds
[3127.08] Frank: And also
[3128.08] Frank: I believe it's got
[3129.08] Frank: A kind of
[3130.08] Frank: Betting part of it
[3131.08] Frank: As well
[3132.08] Frank: If I'm not much mistaken
[3133.08] Frank: I've only seen it
[3134.08] Frank: Mentioned in passing
[3135.08] Frank: But
[3136.08] Frank: It's definitely something to do with
[3137.08] Frank: Racing
[3138.08] Frank: And following the feeds
[3141.08] Jack: Yeah
[3142.08] Jack: Okay
[3143.08] Jack: Well
[3144.08] Jack: I've got a silly question
[3146.08] Jack: And I've got a
[3147.08] Jack: Half sensible
[3148.08] Jack: Question
[3149.08] Tony: Which one do you want to do first?
[3151.08] Tony: Which one do you want to do first?
[3153.08] Jack: You know when the new
[3155.08] Jack: Processors for Max come out
[3157.08] Jack: Will compatibility be really good?
[3162.08] hydra: Who's that question directed to?
[3164.08] Jack: You, Mr Klinklei
[3166.08] hydra: Me, why do you think I would know about that?
[3169.08] hydra: I used to
[3170.08] Jack: I have a prime history
[3172.08] hydra: History in tech support
[3173.08] hydra: I did like
[3174.08] hydra: Maybe 15 years of tech support
[3176.08] hydra: And I used to be the guy
[3177.08] hydra: On the end of the phone
[3178.08] hydra: When you were typing into a Vax VMS system
[3181.08] hydra: Going
[3182.08] hydra: My program doesn't work
[3183.08] hydra: Why?
[3184.08] hydra: And I'm like
[3185.08] hydra: Well
[3186.08] hydra: Have you tried this?
[3187.08] hydra: Have you tried that?
[3188.08] hydra: I never once
[3189.08] hydra: I already said
[3190.08] hydra: Have you tried switching it off and on again?
[3191.08] hydra: I never said that
[3192.08] hydra: Why not?
[3193.08] hydra: Only
[3194.08] hydra: So many problems
[3195.08] hydra: Noob tech supports
[3196.08] Curry: I used to use
[3197.08] Curry: An 11 750
[3198.08] Curry: And micro Vaxxers
[3200.08] Curry: And even a PDP 11
[3202.08] Curry: He knows
[3203.08] Curry: He knows
[3204.08] Curry: Oh my god
[3205.08] Curry: We don't f***ing each other off
[3208.08] Curry: I found my code for it the other day
[3210.08] Curry: Whilst I was looking for my Amiga disks
[3212.08] Curry: I found loads and loads of Fortran
[3214.08] hydra: Yeah, I've still got loads of Amiga disks in the garage
[3217.08] hydra: I don't know whether they're readable anymore
[3219.08] hydra: But yeah
[3220.08] hydra: Cool
[3221.08] hydra: Those were the days
[3222.08] hydra: Yeah, because it was all
[3223.08] hydra: This was back before
[3224.08] hydra: Ethernet stuff I was doing all this
[3226.08] hydra: It was all
[3227.08] hydra: RS232 serial comms
[3229.08] hydra: You know, manual covers
[3231.08] hydra: Connecting six wires together
[3233.08] hydra: Or whatever it was
[3234.08] hydra: Or maybe eight or something
[3235.08] hydra: For the
[3236.08] hydra: Data
[3237.08] hydra: Or the data lines
[3238.08] hydra: And so on
[3239.08] hydra: With the multiplexers
[3240.08] hydra: And then
[3241.08] hydra: Ken10base2 came along
[3242.08] hydra: The one way you could
[3243.08] hydra: On Friday afternoon go
[3244.08] hydra: Quick unplug the cable
[3245.08] hydra: And then your entire office network
[3247.08] hydra: Would go out
[3248.08] hydra: And then you would sit back
[3249.08] hydra: And have a coffee
[3250.08] hydra: While you talked to tech support
[3251.08] hydra: And everyone had a nice Friday afternoon
[3253.08] hydra: But those days long gone
[3254.08] hydra: They introduced Starpoint Networks
[3255.08] hydra: And now you can't do that
[3257.08] hydra: Damn it
[3258.08] Tony: There's another
[3260.08] Tony: There's another
[3261.08] Tony: Important question from Painless
[3265.08] hydra: Color OSD tech
[3268.08] hydra: I hadn't ever created any color OSD tech
[3272.08] hydra: Is one way of answering that
[3275.08] Curry: What's the pixel thing you mentioned though?
[3278.08] hydra: So the way that that story went
[3280.08] hydra: More developer fallout
[3281.08] hydra: Drama, here we go
[3282.08] hydra: Let's do it
[3283.08] hydra: Let's do it
[3284.08] hydra: Let's go round two
[3285.08] hydra: Ding ding
[3286.08] hydra: So
[3287.08] hydra: Any views expressed by Dominic Clinton?
[3290.08] hydra: Yeah
[3291.08] hydra: He's the job
[3292.08] hydra: Sue him
[3293.08] hydra: Oh no
[3294.08] hydra: It's all good
[3295.08] hydra: It's all good
[3296.08] hydra: So there was a guy called Alberte
[3298.08] hydra: Also who lives in Spain
[3300.08] hydra: Who said and started work on iNav OSD
[3304.08] hydra: And if you look on the GitHub
[3306.08] hydra: You can find the initial project of that there
[3308.08] hydra: I contacted him and said
[3311.08] hydra: Do you want to make something that
[3314.08] hydra: Because I can put this into production
[3315.08] hydra: Because he was just doing software side of things
[3318.08] hydra: And some of the hardware side of things
[3320.08] hydra: So we got talking
[3321.08] hydra: I gave him a bunch of ideas
[3322.08] hydra: He gave me a bunch of ideas
[3323.08] hydra: The first guy offered him a boatload of money
[3325.08] hydra: He now works for FrSky
[3326.08] hydra: And that's why he got the FrSky OSD
[3328.08] hydra: So I went
[3330.08] hydra: Well
[3331.08] hydra: Probably can make my own
[3333.08] hydra: And then
[3334.08] UNKNOWN: Ooh
[3335.08] hydra: Look
[3336.08] hydra: Show treat
[3337.08] hydra: There is
[3339.08] hydra: Pixel OSD
[3341.08] hydra: Running on an L4 processor
[3343.08] hydra: This is my original prototype
[3345.08] hydra: Which works
[3346.08] hydra: Absolutely fine
[3347.08] hydra: The yellow wires are video in and video out
[3349.08] hydra: And there's
[3351.08] hydra: Yeah, an L4 processor somewhere in the middle
[3353.08] hydra: And this was made maybe or so
[3355.08] hydra: About
[3357.08] hydra: Maybe a week or so
[3358.08] hydra: I think after Alberte went into work for FrSky
[3363.08] Jack: Do we end it here?
[3365.08] hydra: No, me and my espanol is malo
[3368.08] Jack: Well we
[3371.08] Jack: We didn't start three minutes late
[3373.08] Jack: Because of my
[3374.08] Jack: After I ate eating
[3376.08] Jack: Dom, have you got anything to plug
[3378.08] Jack: Or complain about
[3379.08] Jack: Or anyone else you know
[3381.08] Jack: You want to like
[3382.08] Jack: Now you've moved away
[3383.08] Jack: You can track the queen off
[3384.08] hydra: If you want to run alternative firmware
[3386.08] hydra: That's not beta flight
[3388.08] hydra: Which I highly recommend
[3390.08] hydra: Then you can run PX4 and flight 1
[3393.08] hydra: On the H7 extremes
[3394.08] hydra: There you go
[3395.08] hydra: In addition to running beta flight and clean flight
[3397.08] hydra: I think it's the only flight controller in the world
[3399.08] hydra: That allows you to run
[3401.08] hydra: All of those four different bits of flight control software
[3404.08] hydra: So that's pretty cool
[3405.08] Frank: Cool
[3408.48] Frank: We've put a link to
[3409.48] Frank: Too seriously pro in the description
[3412.48] Frank: And it'll be in the show notes as well
[3414.48] Frank: Thanks
[3415.48] Tony: Do you want to come back in ten years when
[3420.48] Tony: No
[3421.48] Tony: Do you want to come back like in six months
[3424.48] Tony: And tell us what you've been up to
[3426.48] hydra: And what you've been fine with and stuff
[3428.48] hydra: It's probably stuff like fixing induction hobs like this
[3432.48] hydra: And climbing up ladders and solar panels
[3435.48] Tony: I don't think ladders and steps are not your thing
[3438.48] Tony: Well that's the thing on that day
[3440.48] hydra: On that day
[3441.48] hydra: I'd actually been climbing up and down a ladder in the mountains
[3444.48] hydra: On the top of the solar panel thing
[3446.48] hydra: Trying to fix this
[3447.48] Tony: You just got to try and tell me about it all then
[3449.48] hydra: About as old as me
[3451.48] hydra: And I'd been up and down on it all day long
[3453.48] hydra: Absolutely no problem
[3454.48] hydra: Come out of the car, fall down the steps
[3456.48] Tony: Wow
[3458.48] hydra: If there was a point in that day
[3460.48] hydra: Where I thought I was going to fall over and break myself
[3462.48] hydra: We'd been going up and down the ladder
[3464.48] hydra: But no
[3465.48] hydra: I'd be going up
[3467.48] hydra: On your phone
[3471.48] hydra: This was the thing that was at the top of the ladder
[3474.48] hydra: It's very old
[3475.48] hydra: It's about as old as me
[3477.48] hydra: Which is pretty old
[3478.48] hydra: How old are you?
[3479.48] hydra: 1974
[3481.48] hydra: When I was born
[3483.48] hydra: This was made in 19... I think it's about 1988 or so
[3488.48] hydra: This is inside here
[3490.48] hydra: It's quite interesting
[3491.48] hydra: If the guy that owns this watches this
[3493.48] hydra: He'll probably laugh
[3494.48] hydra: There's four solar panels in there
[3497.48] hydra: Really, really old ones
[3500.48] Curry: Quite small
[3502.48] hydra: Yes
[3504.48] hydra: What it does, it basically...
[3506.48] hydra: The sunlight comes through the slits on it
[3509.48] hydra: And then it knows which direction has got more sun
[3511.48] hydra: And it just moves this giant thing up and down
[3514.48] hydra: That's right, towards the sun
[3515.48] hydra: That's what it's called
[3516.48] hydra: And I was hoping for it because it was cool
[3519.48] hydra: Because there's no drama when you're fixing someone's
[3521.48] hydra: Solar panel tracking system
[3522.48] hydra: Instead of developing for beat-a-fly
[3524.48] hydra: I did that
[3527.48] hydra: A lovely day
[3528.48] hydra: Can we know next week
[3530.48] Curry: We'll have the solar farm owner on
[3532.48] Curry: Who will complain about the way Dominic Bifton
[3534.48] Curry: Fixed that particular thing
[3535.48] Tony: Can we get that as a soundbite, please?
[3540.48] Jack: He puts in a bug request to himself
[3547.48] Tony: It's too cloudy in England
[3549.48] Tony: Yeah
[3551.48] hydra: They've changed the laws in Spain
[3554.48] hydra: So it actually makes it useful to actually get solar power as a company
[3558.48] hydra: Because I think there was this whole double-tax thing out here in Spain
[3561.48] hydra: Which is really stupid
[3562.48] hydra: Because it's like the one place that gets sun all the frickin' time
[3565.48] hydra: And it should be like, solar power should be just everywhere here
[3568.48] hydra: But the government said, no, no, no, Endesa
[3571.48] hydra: We love you
[3572.48] hydra: Give us your money
[3574.48] hydra: But don't tell anybody that you're giving us money
[3576.48] hydra: And we'll help you out, too
[3577.48] hydra: That's the power company in Spain
[3581.48] Jack: Right, thank you so much for coming on
[3584.48] Jack: I think
[3585.48] Jack: Until we get any PSes
[3587.48] Jack: If you're unhappy
[3588.48] hydra: I nearly chucked on my tea
[3591.48] Jack: I've had over 22 years
[3594.48] Jack: Don't listen to him
[3595.48] Jack: He's a goblin
[3596.48] Jack: That's why he gets kicked out of everyone's slack
[3602.48] hydra: I just want to make cool stuff, God damn it
[3604.48] hydra: I just want to make cool stuff
[3606.48] Jack: I know, but you've got some sort of personality
[3609.48] Jack: Disorder
[3610.48] Jack: I don't know what's wrong with you
[3611.48] Jack: No, I don't either
[3613.48] Jack: It's weird
[3615.48] Jack: I know
[3616.48] Jack: Oh, God
[3617.48] Jack: At least you're not time-cop
[3618.48] Jack: Where you actually scream at people all the time
[3621.48] Jack: And threaten to kill them
[3622.48] Jack: Even though you're on the run
[3625.48] Jack: Right
[3626.48] Jack: Anyway, thank you
[3627.48] Jack: You've been listening to Let's Throw Now
[3628.48] Jack: You've been joined by everyone's favourite
[3630.48] Jack: And my favourite, Curry Kitten
[3633.48] Jack: Goodbye
[3634.48] Jack: He's delicious
[3635.48] Jack: Even if you do dip a poppadum into him
[3638.48] Jack: My lovely wife, Tone Star
[3640.48] Jack: For sure
[3643.48] Jack: Our guest for tonight, Mr Dominic Clifton, Clean Flight
[3647.48] Jack: As Bender would say
[3648.48] Jack: Cheeze it
[3649.48] Jack: Yep
[3650.48] Jack: The puppet master, Andrew Nash Frank
[3654.48] Jack: Goodbye
[3655.48] Jack: With a wonderful blow job
[3657.48] Jack: I mean, dry
[3658.48] Jack: Leave that in, editor
[3659.48] Jack: I don't know
[3660.48] Jack: I don't know where you can
[3661.48] Jack: And I've been bright until I fly
[3664.48] Jack: Thank you very much
[3665.48] Jack: Goodnight
[3666.48] Jack: Of all our lovely Patreons
[3667.48] Jack: And especially FX Node
[3669.48] Jack: And Zero for donating
[3672.48] Jack: Cheers, guys
[3673.48] Jack: That helps
[3674.48] Jack: Andrew Star Frank from Killing Me
[3675.48] Jack: And I might get money for those things
[3679.48] Frank: And next week I believe
[3680.48] Frank: Tony has got on a guest next week
[3684.48] Frank: Talking about their new podcast
[3686.48] Frank: That they've just started up
[3688.48] Frank: Is it Onigiri?
[3689.48] Frank: Please do
[3690.48] Tony: So tune in next week for that
[3691.48] Tony: Oh my God, you're going to have to remind me
[3693.48] Tony: To do some stuff
[3696.48] Tony: Alright, see you all next week, guys
[3699.48] Curry: Bye, bye
[3700.48] Curry: See ya
[3701.48] Tony: Tally ho
[3702.48] Tony: Telemetry lost