=== Let's Drone Out — Episode 329 ===
Title: LDO 329 - KISS ULTRA FC W/ Alexander Fedorov
Recorded: 2021-12-16
Hosts: Jack "Brightontillifly" Nash, Tony "TheTonstar1" Marchant, Stephen "Belrik" Howell, Andrew "Frank" Hyams
Guest(s): Alexander "fedorcomander" Fedorov
Total audience: 2,961
Platforms: YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mX03kXoAxCc); SoundCloud (http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/1179718582-letsdroneout-ldo-329-he-built-these-pids-on-pitch-and-roll.mp3)
=====================================

Alexander Fedorov https://kiss-ultra.com
https://github.com/KissUltra/wiki/wiki
https://www.patreon.com/fedorcommander

#KISSULTRA #LETSDRONEOUT #PODCAST

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[0.0] Jack: Hello and you're listening to let's drone out and special thank you to our lovely patrons that help donate
[7.48] Jack: So that we could pay the editor to remove the swear words and silly things. We say
[12.56] Jack: Massive. Thank you to Carlos campos art folk now, Sam Darma
[19.36] Tony: Mikey dread
[21.12] Frank: On with the show
[23.6] Tony: Let's go now
[53.94] Jack: You are listening to let's grown out
[56.18] Jack: Tonight we are joined by steven. Hello everyone. I'm bright till I fly we are joined by tony
[63.62] Jack: Bonjour my darling wife
[66.18] Jack: um, and we are joined by
[68.9] Jack: I should have asked you before alex your uh, your how to pronounce your surname, but uh
[76.1] Jack: It's alexander
[78.66] Jack: federal
[79.86] Jack: commander
[81.7] Alex: No, that's not my surname. It's not
[84.34] Alex: Not in my passport. Uh, no, no, no the last name official. Our last name official is further off
[89.86] Alex: But this is russian like feather off is is okay, too
[94.58] Alex: Mostly go by just uniquely
[97.3] Jack: Yeah, no worries
[99.3] Jack: um
[100.34] Jack: You've been working on um
[102.34] Jack: uh, the kiss fightwear
[104.98] Jack: uh firmware, uh controller
[107.7] Jack: and you
[109.06] Jack: run a patreon
[110.66] Jack: And I believe that you uh work on the code
[114.74] Jack: and
[115.62] Jack: everyone who
[117.46] Jack: Is a member of your patreon and has access to special firmware
[122.26] Jack: The allows for things like return to home or fail safe
[126.02] Jack: And all that all that good stuff
[129.38] Jack: um
[130.9] Jack: as such
[132.34] Jack: and
[133.7] Jack: You've been as
[135.38] Jack: I think I i'm aware that you've been maintaining the the the code as well
[140.18] Jack: so you
[141.54] Jack: um
[142.66] Jack: you've been adding uh set of features and
[146.98] Jack: Like new stuff up to up to a point. So
[151.38] Jack: Is that right?
[153.14] Alex: Yeah, it's very uh, very true
[156.34] Alex: Uh, except chronologically, it's a little bit more complicated than that
[160.9] Stephen: Yeah, I do. I was going to ask actually for kiss newbies. Could we start with the chrono?
[165.84] Stephen: Chronological parts and like where it came from how you got involved
[169.62] Alex: Yeah, that would be a long story, but I think it would make more sense to do that because patreon it's like something
[175.94] Alex: Uh came a couple of years ago and it was
[179.76] Alex: Created, uh by request of the users. Actually, I didn't never wanted patreon. So
[185.3] Alex: Users actually forced me to do that
[188.18] Alex: and uh, well
[189.78] Alex: Just uh, tell me where do you want me to start? So, uh, I think i'm in the drone world since
[196.32] Alex: 2013
[199.14] Alex: It's quite a long time actually
[202.18] Jack: so that so i'm i'm wondering does that put you in with like multi-way or
[209.78] Alex: No base flight was my first one on nasa 32
[214.5] Jack: Oh man, so you're
[217.78] Alex: No, i'm lying i'm lying. It was open pilot for a week and then it was nazi 32
[224.74] Alex: Yeah, open pilot didn't work well for me. So and I have steel bumps on my ceiling from it. So
[234.18] Jack: Yeah, so uh andrew's ash frank who's uh, unfortunately very unwell, um
[240.34] Jack: but we hope for a speedy recovery and uh
[244.34] Jack: Hope you hope you get better buddy. Um
[247.54] Jack: As far as I know he's doing. Okay, uh 17 the poll says what is kiss?
[253.62] Jack: um
[254.74] Jack: I believe uh kiss is a fork from the multi-way firmware
[262.58] Alex: Is it not? I don't know not really
[265.7] Alex: kiss was created by fly do you know and uh felix
[269.94] Alex: Was responsible to actual creation of it. He was working there at uh at the time
[274.9] Alex: but then I was making nice qch's and uh,
[278.18] Alex: we know all these little firecrackers and cleaning them with the ipa and
[284.18] Alex: With the toothbrush was a nice process a nice evening. I was made out of it
[289.22] Alex: and
[289.86] Alex: Uh at some point in time, let me check when I think in 2015 end of year, uh felix also made a
[297.86] Alex: flight controller that was f3 based at that time it was a hot item
[304.02] Alex: And uh with very limited firmware, but beeper was doing just babe and uh
[310.26] Alex: That was uh time when the kiss was born
[313.94] Alex: I got my kiss in the beginning of 2016
[317.62] Alex: so pretty much very
[319.86] Alex: soon after it was released
[322.34] Alex: and
[323.38] Alex: Well, it's a bit of light just ended for me
[328.1] Alex: That's that's when kiss started
[332.46] Tony: Yeah, so you
[334.54] Tony: No, carry on saying that was a success probably when you started using kiss minute
[339.34] Alex: That was when I when I started using kiss. Yes, and I was
[343.82] Alex: really nice time and really nice flight with uh
[347.34] Alex: I was
[348.7] Alex: Well, not literally just blown away with uh with how it flies compared to what I had before it was bed flight
[355.34] Alex: and uh, yeah
[357.9] Alex: I started
[359.34] Alex: a few weeks later
[360.7] Tony: started to fly
[362.7] Tony: Jack used to fly a kiss and bang on about how good it was for ages, wouldn't you jack? Yeah, um,
[368.3] Jack: uh to the point where tony
[370.7] Jack: Uh refused to try it
[373.74] Jack: but I like if you're using um open, uh
[380.86] Jack: Open toilet, um, i'm guessing you you had had a cc3d
[387.26] Jack: Yeah, that's right. Yeah
[389.34] Jack: So and you you say you beat fly but it must have been
[394.38] Jack: Base flight you must have had clean flight
[397.66] Alex: Yes. Yes, at first a nice asset. This was did I said better flight? It was base flight
[403.02] Alex: Was a base flight for a week and then clean flight was
[407.82] Alex: Released I think clean flight was after base flight, right? Yeah
[412.46] Alex: It was I flashed it very carefully and was like oh, that's nice
[417.26] Alex: uh
[418.54] Alex: Then uh, it was for a year or so then boys started to commit more than uh
[425.02] Alex: All uh clean flight team together I think and changes were so fast and he decided to fork it just to do a better flight
[434.3] Alex: And yes
[436.54] Jack: Yeah, it it was
[438.38] Jack: it was uh
[440.06] Jack: It was on the RC groups
[442.3] Jack: And there were so many um pull requests
[445.9] Jack: And things weren't getting done fast enough. And I think the I think the for him was the notch fillers
[454.14] Alex: No, it came later. It came later
[456.94] Alex: Was it uh start it started started I think uh
[461.1] Alex: Uh, what's the biggest one was uh, uh, the uh when the nickels sherlock that's the guy who made the black box. Uh
[468.86] Alex: Find I made a very nice program that logs actually CPU utilization per function
[475.98] Alex: And they realized that is like 80 percent of time goes to just deal with what i2c bus to wait and do nothing
[484.46] Alex: and uh, that was
[486.68] Alex: Improvements, you know loop loop time got very shorter and uh
[492.22] Alex: Uh, what then it was changes in the pit controller there was like four pit controllers and uh
[499.26] Alex: One was from multi-v or integer arithmetics and stuff
[503.5] Alex: and uh
[504.7] Alex: What bore started to do he started to dig in to look float controller. That was fully based with float arithmetics
[513.42] Alex: And that wasn't actually when the fun was for me. Uh
[517.18] Alex: started, uh
[518.46] Alex: I talked a lot to to boris at the time and uh, he was using me as a tester
[522.94] Alex: He was also sending me code and I was running to uh, my flying spot
[527.26] Alex: It was like five minutes walk from here and to fly it was was fun time
[532.06] Jack: Yeah, yeah, I I remember back in 2015 2016 me and
[538.3] Jack: tony and and frank were interviewing boris, so it's kind of
[542.86] Jack: it's kind of nice to have a like mutual friend of
[547.1] Jack: You know and unfortunately boris has just totally disappeared off the face of the earth
[552.22] Jack: Which is a real shame. I do. I do miss him
[555.66] Jack: on these videos
[557.66] Alex: Nice guy. Nice guys. Never never met him. Actually, we live in the same country
[561.82] Alex: He was working over like five kilometers from place where i'm living
[565.34] Alex: He was flying on my sports, but we never met that. I think it's just you know
[571.18] Stephen: Normal, so alexander. How did you get involved?
[575.18] Stephen: And building your own boards then?
[579.02] Alex: Uh, you're just jumping like five years later
[585.66] Alex: Yeah, that's a big jump so, uh
[587.9] Alex: We want to know a bit more how it was moved from better flight to keys or yeah. Yeah. Yeah straight away to
[595.64] Alex: 2021
[596.7] Alex: No
[598.14] Tony: Let's do that. Let's not do the jump
[600.94] Alex: Uh, well, that was fun with uh with better flight
[604.94] Alex: And uh, I even have some commits in better flight actually, so it still still runs
[609.9] Alex: and uh
[611.5] Alex: Something for black box. I did uh with nicole sherlock was helping him at the time
[617.82] Alex: Actually, he gave me permission to implement a black box logger on kiss. Uh, so I
[623.18] Alex: Asked him. Can I do that?
[625.34] Alex: He said yeah, no problem with that
[628.3] Alex: Well, uh, when I started flying his well, it was flying great, but there was not much
[635.1] Alex: But it can do compared to
[637.9] Alex: Existing better flight at the time
[640.22] Alex: So, you know even bipper didn't work and there was like
[643.82] Alex: Three aux functions which do nothing besides arm and level
[648.3] Alex: So, uh, I started just to poke around and try to make my own logging kind of thing
[654.3] Alex: Outside of the system just logging telemetry between uh, osd and uh
[660.94] Alex: uh flight controller and uh, well I showed the show to you know to people and uh
[667.5] Alex: Somebody so uh from fly doing that's what i'm doing and then I thought well they have nice gooey. Let's do it
[674.54] Alex: Android version for the phone. I had android
[677.98] Alex: tablet at the time
[679.66] Alex: Yeah, so I did it. I showed them and they kind of liked it
[682.7] Alex: So they said well, maybe you want to join the team?
[687.18] Alex: Uh
[688.38] Alex: Then well then I said well, why not i'm doing it anyways, so maybe people will you know benefit from it
[694.86] Alex: So I was pretty much too careful the gooey stuff
[698.46] Alex: I added, you know all the pages you see till now is uh before it was just one page and
[703.82] Alex: Well made some extension and make it uh a little bit more advanced and uh, I think in
[714.06] Alex: 2016
[717.34] Alex: Uh in the summer there was a big problem with oscillations and felix, uh couldn't work for like few months
[725.26] Alex: Just family stuff and people start suffering and leaving and well, I start to you know
[731.74] Alex: Coding more and uh pretty much
[734.78] Alex: Took care of took care of kiss uh for for felix and fly do you know for a time?
[740.46] Alex: So start to code more
[742.46] Alex: you know get uh
[745.02] Alex: Familiar with code base
[747.42] Alex: Well quite a lot of things was down there
[752.16] Alex: That's well, and it was going for for quite a while
[757.52] Alex: I think a couple of years then I realized I spent
[760.88] Alex: uh
[762.24] Alex: More time supporting kiss than I would uh would allow myself
[766.96] Alex: Yeah, I practically stopped flying to just do coding coding coding
[771.28] Alex: Then I just left kiss for a year
[773.84] Alex: More than a year. I think on the half year. I just said enough
[778.4] Alex: but
[779.52] Alex: uh
[780.32] Alex: Well, there are there are nice people in the world
[783.12] Alex: Somebody said well there are there are gg. I think so
[786.4] Alex: Would you like to implement it and we all sent you all the g here? So what you need?
[792.32] Alex: I'm curious guy. So it's something new great
[796.0] Alex: So I I started to do ggi stuff and uh, yeah
[801.36] Alex: Kiss pilot said well, why don't you make?
[804.48] Alex: patreon
[807.04] Alex: Fly doing it was okay with that. So everybody was okay. So if you wanted, okay
[811.52] Alex: I don't mind to have a few bucks on the side
[815.04] Alex: For toys and uh, I started to to code for
[819.12] Alex: for patreons who support me and uh, well
[823.12] Alex: Did uh, nine things like gps support rth ggi support?
[829.2] Alex: Uh ghost support
[831.76] Jack: Well, you know, I appreciate that one. Thank you
[835.6] Alex: Yeah, uh failsafe was reread and I want quite a lot of things
[839.28] Alex: It was kind of pre ultra time and uh, I was committing it also to the master branch of case
[845.28] Alex: So fat tech and case can anybody can can benefit from it actually?
[851.04] Alex: Well, and then oh
[853.04] Alex: Then kiss ultra happened
[856.56] Alex: That's different story
[858.32] Jack: All right. No worries. Did you just get tired? Um of waiting for uh, isd to be implemented?
[866.72] Alex: Turkish flight controller. No, not really. Not really. The thing is
[871.44] Alex: Uh, and you can talk to to alexander wolf. We had a lot of discussion about osd. So it's different. I think I was
[878.32] Alex: Completely against osd. I I want something else from osd
[883.04] Alex: And uh, I thought well, you know pilot doesn't need osd then
[887.84] Alex: I thought well if I what it will look like if I want to make one for myself
[894.48] Jack: Yeah, because um, I believe is it a vector isd now instead of the individual characters
[901.04] Alex: It's a fully graphical osd with semi-transparency. It's 60 frames per second
[906.4] Alex: So it's not like the others because usually you have like extra cpu that
[913.58] Alex: communicates with serial
[915.2] Alex: Port to the flight controller gets the data over a certain protocol msp or case protocol
[922.0] Alex: Yeah, you name it and then it just shows it like 10 times per second if you like one time per second
[927.76] Alex: So but the thing is it's kind of very limiting you have osd with firmware you need to update it
[934.0] Alex: that needs to be in sync with uh
[936.48] Alex: With flight uh flight controller firmware
[939.44] Alex: If you change something you need to update both and it's not really fast
[945.2] Alex: And it's limiting because well you can't transfer anything
[949.84] Alex: You can't transfer everything over the serial
[952.88] Alex: So I thought well, why not to have just osd on the same cpu?
[957.84] Alex: so and
[959.2] Alex: Yes, you have it like computer you have computer screen. So you put pixel there and it's there immediately
[964.48] Alex: So you have 60 frames per second
[966.8] Alex: You have a full graphic
[968.88] Alex: It's like 512 pixels wide
[972.4] Alex: 270 high
[974.4] Alex: high so
[975.76] Alex: and
[976.96] Alex: It just looks great
[980.0] Alex: Yeah
[981.44] Alex: Well, the thing is then you have something you can show on the screen, but you need to have osd itself and
[988.72] Alex: Initially we sought to to use uh, alexander wolf's code on the ultra osd, but uh
[996.4] Alex: It ended up not really
[998.78] Alex: compatible with
[1000.78] Alex: Uh with uh the way I program it
[1004.06] Alex: So it's a bit too heavy for my needs because it's one cpu. It needs to fly it needs to render 60 frames per second
[1011.42] Alex: Well, if you look at that, it's not a picnic
[1015.1] Alex: It's quite interesting thing to do, but you don't want to be there. It's really time critical. So I thought well, okay
[1022.54] Alex: We could use something else or we can just write it from scratch
[1026.7] Alex: So I thought well I have code for keychain configurator
[1031.9] Alex: It can edit parameters on the little OLED screen. Yeah, why not to use it for osd as a base?
[1039.5] Alex: And pretty much I ported it from uh keychain to uh to ultra
[1045.82] Alex: That's how osd was born actually
[1048.38] Jack: No way
[1049.58] Jack: Yeah, yeah, I know it was it was weird. Like I got to chat with um
[1054.86] Jack: Dominic clifton when rowright was in the gay. Um, we sat down having chat with him and um
[1062.06] Jack: like it turned out that uh, some of the osd code came from
[1068.14] Jack: um him trying to uh use like a better way of using addressable leds and um
[1076.7] Jack: And then some of that also went into like, you know, the d-shot code as well, which is quite weird
[1082.78] Jack: So
[1087.34] Alex: Well, i'm doing it a bit differently what what he's talking it's uh,
[1090.78] Alex: Well on the cpu you have two things that is used pretty much for all you have timers you have direct memory access
[1097.5] Alex: basically timer it's ticking and it tells
[1100.94] Alex: the
[1102.46] Alex: What to output on?
[1105.02] Alex: On the certain pin using direct memory access. That's how the short works. We have you have uh, what 60 sticks
[1112.14] Alex: 16 bits you have timing it says one zero one zero one zero done
[1116.06] Alex: So that's your d-shot command same things you have for osd. You have one line of pixels
[1121.66] Alex: You need to sync on the beginning of the line and then you need to just clock out
[1126.14] Alex: What you want to show over the screen, but you need to be very precise any jitter
[1132.54] Alex: You will see this tiny minor shifts. It's really annoying
[1137.1] Jack: Wow, yeah, that's all like flicker
[1139.98] Alex: It's kind of flickerish, but it looks like your uh charters on osd. They're not sharp. So
[1148.06] Jack: Over scan
[1149.5] Alex: Yeah, so i'm doing something very weird on h7. It's a little bit undocumented and took me kind of like months
[1158.46] Alex: To find the way how to clock out signals
[1161.5] Alex: The way I want it without loading cpu a lot. So it's it's very important actually
[1171.34] Jack: So one one of the reasons why I kind of like begged you to come on was I was I was watching um
[1178.46] Jack: Like I approached you like message like hey
[1181.34] Jack: Do either podcast and we forgot about it and then I was watching uh, joshua bardwell stream and um
[1188.86] Jack: Like I was I sat there and I was watching it and then
[1192.46] Jack: Like kiss comes up and they're just like they don't know
[1196.22] Jack: What to do it do with it kill it with fire. They're just like, you know, they think it's witchcraft or something
[1204.14] Jack: and
[1205.1] Jack: There was there's some real like misinformation out there. They were like, oh, yeah, you know, it's
[1211.66] Jack: You know, like it's stolen code or whatever, you know
[1214.94] Jack: You haven't got permission and I kind of like spat my drink out and I was like, no
[1220.46] Jack: Luckily blunt. He corrected it. Don't worry
[1223.34] Jack: but um, he was just you know
[1226.3] Jack: You have permission from fly. Do we know kiss?
[1230.22] Jack: And felix and obviously because you worked with them. So
[1234.86] Alex: Uh, I don't need to have permission from felix. That's one thing so he's working
[1240.7] Alex: I have a license agreement with uh with spall
[1245.34] Alex: For fly. Do you know so it's all official. It's uh, there's nothing is stolen
[1251.34] Alex: There's a well imagine in like four or five years the amount of code I wrote for kiss is now is like 85
[1258.86] Alex: Is my code I wrote it still well was property of uh fly. Do you know, of course, but uh
[1266.22] Alex: Uh, we have agreement that I uh the code I wrote for ultra i'm not going to open to anyone. So that's
[1272.94] Alex: That's my thing and we have agreement with that. So basically everything what what I do
[1278.46] Alex: Is agreed upon up front with uh with fly. Do you know even the shape of the flight controller?
[1283.66] Alex: We wanted to have the same shape
[1285.82] Alex: That kiss v2 has almost the same shape, but uh, we got the permission to use it
[1292.38] Alex: so
[1293.74] Alex: Blunty was right
[1295.34] Jack: Yeah. Yeah, no worries. And I it was yeah, there's
[1299.42] Jack: some people, you know
[1301.74] Jack: uh, uh, like not really following it closely and
[1305.26] Jack: You you understand, you know, you understand like there's misinformation out there and it's not really
[1312.3] Jack: Sort of that that open and and out there
[1316.06] Jack: So I can kind of understand but all I can say is kiss it's not flight. Uh, yeah, race flight
[1324.14] Jack: You know
[1325.18] Alex: well
[1325.98] Alex: Not really
[1327.1] Jack: no
[1328.14] Jack: but um, is it is it true i've heard like the rumors that like with the kiss ultra you're gonna
[1334.7] Jack: Take in your sort of like own direction. Is that true? You're gonna
[1339.58] Jack: Or is it still going to follow?
[1341.66] Jack: uh
[1343.1] Jack: kiss
[1344.7] Alex: Uh, it it is going its own direction for for you know since uh june last year. So that's that's that's another thing
[1352.62] Alex: but
[1353.66] Alex: Uh whole idea of the project. Well, I was not really happy with where the
[1360.62] Alex: Kiss
[1361.98] Alex: Is going lead leaded by fat tech. So I thought well, let's do it
[1367.5] Alex: The way we like it and whole idea is to keep it kiss
[1372.86] Alex: Keep the same feel don't change a lot
[1376.06] Alex: Improve it, but you know when people fly kiss they say well it is kiss
[1382.14] Alex: That's
[1383.1] Alex: I don't know what felix did it but there there's no magic
[1386.38] Alex: It's it's a code, but it's quite a nice code to fly. It feels good and people looking for that feel
[1393.18] Alex: That's not gonna change
[1395.66] Alex: it can be improved, but it's
[1399.58] Alex: basically, well i'm working on some things now and I see it is
[1404.94] Alex: Not working the way I want it and the flight behavior is changing. So I just dropped it and you know
[1411.02] Alex: Through the way not good
[1413.5] Alex: Don't have problem to start all over again
[1415.9] Alex: but
[1417.02] Alex: I think
[1418.54] Alex: We'll try it is kiss on steroids. It's kiss next level
[1423.34] Alex: Well ultra it is beyond kiss. So that that's the meaning of ultra
[1428.68] Alex: Interesting
[1430.3] Jack: yeah, um
[1432.06] Jack: Is anyone still developing kiss like or because it feels really?
[1437.9] Jack: Sort of stagnated, you know with with the updates it hasn't really been
[1443.02] Jack: there hasn't been like a
[1445.1] Jack: ESC
[1446.38] Jack: update for feet for ages with like on the
[1450.46] Jack: You know, it's kind of everything's kind of gone stable. Is there any more development for just regular kiss or?
[1457.74] Alex: Well, uh, first of all I do on the flight controller, so I don't really care about the system
[1463.74] Alex: Yeah, they they're really not my thing so
[1467.98] Alex: I can't can't tell what's the plans or what's what's going on the nhc land for fly do you know?
[1474.06] Alex: Flight controller wise. Uh, well officially fedtech has a maintenance contract with fly do you know, and I think they
[1481.26] Alex: Think they do maintenance for the old
[1484.3] Alex: kiss code base
[1486.38] Alex: well, I have some reservations about it, but
[1490.06] Alex: Uh, that's that is it is what it is. Uh on other side
[1495.18] Alex: I do support for my patreon users and that's pretty much
[1499.98] Alex: most advanced kiss firmware at the moment
[1503.1] Alex: Well, i'm missing some things but they're not really relevant by ghost support. Uh, I think I did go support
[1509.34] Alex: Yeah, I think I did go support. Yeah, uh crossfire three, I think is missing there but um, uh for people who is using
[1516.7] Alex: kiss for long flight
[1519.5] Alex: Long-range flight and using gps and rth. That's that's pretty much firmware to go
[1525.98] Alex: Because I think since I released rth
[1529.98] Alex: Uh
[1531.18] Alex: nine quads were saved
[1533.18] Alex: Just from falling to c and uh, you know, it's it's just one extra makes makes you want to go further
[1541.42] Alex: It's it's just what you've been working for and uh, rth was really fun to do. I never flew it actually myself
[1548.3] Alex: So it was flown only by my testers and uh testers logging and uh, well, we flew I think more than 300 lipos while doing it
[1556.62] Alex: a lot
[1558.78] Alex: Uh, so people like it, uh, but uh, I decided not to share the code when I start ultra
[1565.18] Alex: And the last piece what I did for rth is rth on failsafe
[1569.58] Alex: It's not included in the official firmware everything before that it's all included. So you have ggi you have
[1576.86] Alex: You name it
[1578.86] Alex: Ultra has everything I ever did
[1582.64] Tony: does
[1583.68] Tony: Uh return to home. Does it come home and land or the is it coming loiter? Just loiter or it's just loiter
[1590.16] Alex: So, uh, we we decided not uh with testers not to go down
[1595.68] Alex: because for example, if you have gps and you was not careful taking off
[1602.56] Alex: and uh
[1604.08] Alex: You're returning there could be up to 30 meters difference actually with uh with a home altitude
[1610.56] Alex: And if you have 40 meters, uh, well return to home and then it goes
[1616.0] Alex: down
[1617.2] Alex: it could be a
[1618.8] Alex: Well, it could be very very bad
[1621.2] Alex: Yeah, so we decided to just the whole idea is it returns its loiters
[1627.36] Alex: You take over control
[1629.2] Alex: If you can't it will just drop that but you will have time to run away
[1633.84] Alex: Until it starts beeping and uh, well, it will start beeping and then it will just fall
[1639.04] Alex: I think falling with just disarmed motors. It's less damage than to just you know
[1644.88] Alex: Go, uh down and spinning the blades
[1648.56] Tony: No, yeah
[1649.6] Tony: Safe to first you save your gopro
[1652.0] Tony: You've got your battery back most of the cord that you could repair if it did fall from the sky anyway
[1657.2] Tony: So and you've saved nine cords so far. That's yeah
[1661.44] Alex: Yeah, that's good man. Brilliant. Thank you. I think rth record, uh, if I remember seven or six kilometers
[1669.44] Alex: And uh nine nine quote. Yeah, that's uh, it's it's
[1674.08] Alex: Yes, uh, it flies actually quite well
[1677.04] Alex: I think uh when I released it better flight boys
[1680.16] Alex: Would change their code a little bit to to fly better because it was like wow
[1684.72] Alex: Where all the time and I see after that they fly smoother
[1688.64] Alex: Uh, very simple. Actually, it's very simply done
[1693.12] Jack: I wonder I'd like to see what speed it comes back at
[1697.76] Jack: Or can you set that?
[1699.28] Alex: Uh, no, actually no, it just comes back when it comes back. Uh, I want to make a speed control
[1705.84] Alex: Yeah, and it's actually worked worse than without it. So basically what it does it just tilts
[1712.56] Alex: And just goes home
[1714.64] Jack: I wonder if you could like average it for consumption. So it
[1719.76] Jack: Eco it monitors the voltage and amp draw and you know
[1725.28] Jack: Like sort of eats it back if you're low on battery
[1730.4] Alex: It will land I guarantee it will land gravity will do the trick
[1735.36] Frank: I know
[1736.24] Frank: This episode was recorded in front of a live online audience downloaded and edited to make sense when it played audio only
[1742.96] Frank: Censored to please the itunes people hosted on the internet forwarded through to your podcast provider
[1747.82] Frank: Downloaded playing on your device and is now playing in your ears all thanks to our patreons
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[1759.28] Frank: Pause slash let's drone out
[1761.28] Jack: We've got a classic question. Um
[1763.36] Jack: How did you start in the hobby? Like how did you hear about drones? What did you buy?
[1769.2] Jack: You know like what drew you into this?
[1772.4] Alex: Oh, that's interesting. I didn't buy anything
[1775.68] Alex: but
[1777.12] Alex: When I was kid, I was doing some
[1780.16] Alex: plane models
[1782.0] Alex: And uh, you know the ones that go with uh with wires. I don't know how it's called in english control line
[1788.56] Alex: Yeah control lines and this kind of things and I really wanted to fly helis
[1793.68] Alex: It was my dream. I love how they look and uh, you know with the
[1798.16] Alex: Nitro engines they do so much noise and but uh in russia at that time, it was not really possible
[1805.6] Alex: Well years uh passed and I think in
[1810.38] Alex: 2013 or 12
[1813.12] Alex: End of the year, uh, it's my birthday and uh
[1816.8] Alex: My wife got me a parrot
[1819.92] Alex: air drone
[1821.36] Jack: Okay
[1822.4] Jack: That was not not skork parrot
[1825.68] Jack: Not on the kill
[1828.08] Jack: Is it the polystyrene ones?
[1830.32] Alex: Yeah, the one with you know with big ears and yeah. Yeah, that's that's uh from from for me
[1836.72] Alex: and
[1837.76] Alex: I
[1838.96] Alex: destroyed it in first day, of course
[1841.76] Alex: so
[1842.4] Alex: but
[1843.44] Alex: A week later it would become one that can fly further with uh real radio with uh arduino on it and with a hack
[1851.68] Alex: That actually replaced the phone. Oh, that was fun. You can fly like 30 meters instead of 10
[1858.8] Alex: and uh
[1859.92] Alex: Yeah, it didn't actually live very long on me. I sold it and I got myself. Uh, uh, what was it?
[1867.2] Alex: I think uh
[1869.04] Alex: Flame wheel from dji
[1871.36] Jack: Oh, yeah
[1872.4] Alex: Yeah, that was that was that one then it was uh tarot 700 and after that it was blackout time
[1880.16] Alex: And no way
[1882.72] Alex: You actually got yourself a blackout. Did you yeah, I had I bought two blackouts one of the first batches
[1889.04] Jack: Blackout the dunk man
[1890.96] Jack: So i'm i'm i'm guessing you had like navigator, uh motors and
[1896.48] Alex: Team I still have it. It's it's on my shelf. I still have that mobius
[1901.6] Alex: and I do have uh
[1903.92] Alex: sony camera and uh
[1906.64] Alex: Wow, it's only ccd. Yeah, exactly 12. Yeah. Oh my god
[1912.16] Alex: It was a little bobbins
[1914.16] Jack: Yeah
[1915.68] Jack: I know so it's really nice to like
[1918.56] Jack: Talk to someone who's been in the hobbit hobby for quite a while because like you saw that video
[1924.64] Alex: Yeah in the forest the star wars video. That's
[1927.68] Alex: It's about that funny
[1929.44] Jack: Meet yeah meet the french guys in it racing and that
[1932.8] Jack: um
[1934.0] Jack: Like because you know as much as i'm mock tony for being a dinosaur like i'm really starting to feel it, you know, uh
[1941.92] Jack: It's like in the hobby. You got all these like new blood come in and
[1946.4] Jack: You know, they don't
[1947.76] Jack: I don't know what pwm stands for. I don't have to
[1951.52] Jack: D-shot
[1952.8] Jack: You know arguing about what was better d shot or multi shot and uh
[1958.4] Jack: I'm glad that one was put to bed
[1960.48] Jack: Um, yeah, I I've done some uh beta testing on the old d shot escs and I had the the dead duck
[1968.0] Jack: You know, uh when d shot come out and the worst part was I've done some long range
[1974.24] Jack: um
[1975.44] Jack: at hidden valley
[1977.52] Jack: Tony will know there's this there's this derelict farmhouse on the other side of the valley
[1982.88] Jack: I flew out there flew back. No problem
[1985.68] Jack: Went to uh stammer park, which is like a little flat
[1989.36] Jack: You know nothing really there park and then i'm orbiting myself with uh, dan opton
[1994.0] Jack: Tony will know one of our old friends in the hobby
[1997.36] Jack: And uh, and then yeah, my my quad escs just you know dead duck fall out the sky
[2003.84] Jack: Pick it up and then it's like and then they're beaconing and stuff
[2008.64] Jack: So yeah, it's just like oh
[2011.68] Tony: That's what the testings about track. I don't
[2014.72] Jack: I was like, yeah, this works great. And then next day it was like
[2018.72] Jack: just dead duck
[2020.4] Jack: so
[2021.44] Jack: um
[2022.88] Jack: simon k for the win. Yes
[2025.92] Jack: Yes, martin
[2027.76] Alex: Yeah, fleshing is freaking disaster
[2031.76] Jack: With um
[2033.2] Jack: uh with the uh atmell header
[2036.8] Jack: Peyton, you know, do you remember that? Yeah, the white thing you put on the trip. Yeah, i've got one of those
[2041.68] Alex: Yeah, yeah, I was fleshing c-labs. Uh c-labs. He sees from ggi
[2046.16] Jack: That's even worse. Oh, what oh my god
[2050.0] Alex: It's like from itches. Yeah, like three wires coming out for just programming them. Yeah, um
[2056.0] Jack: So you said you put an arduino on the um
[2060.16] Jack: On on the parrot. Yeah
[2062.96] Jack: That must have been mowie-wee code
[2065.6] Alex: Surely it's not my code
[2067.84] Alex: I thought
[2069.68] Alex: No, no, no, it was not multi. The thing is parrot was running linux
[2073.76] Alex: and there was a debug connectors on the
[2077.04] Alex: On the belly of the quad where you can just connect terminal and basically there was arduino was taking
[2084.64] Alex: ppm input from from receiver normal receiver
[2089.04] Alex: And just converting it to uh to pretty much shell commands they go left go right
[2094.88] Alex: And so you don't need a phone to control it and you can do it with uh with you know, team fail safe radio
[2101.92] Alex: It worked quite well not that far but uh quite well better than phone for sure
[2109.2] Tony: That is crazy
[2111.12] Tony: Yeah
[2112.0] Tony: Can we see a t-shirt, please?
[2114.64] Tony: This is
[2116.4] Jack: Kiss me
[2119.12] Alex: It's a dear friend of mine, uh made it's uh, it's an official and friend of mine made like 25 of them
[2126.24] Alex: In the world and I got two of them for me in frances. I love it
[2129.6] Jack: I like it. I like it crux fpv said elephant in the room stock
[2135.12] Jack: um
[2136.64] Jack: Yeah, you've got more stock in
[2139.76] Alex: Uh of what?
[2141.68] Jack: I guess kiss ultra. Yeah, of course. I have yeah. Yeah, so um, they're available from uh
[2148.88] Jack: Is it the the the du the the german?
[2154.24] Jack: One and uh
[2156.88] Jack: Yes
[2161.58] Jack: And I think um
[2164.46] Jack: Impulse rc as well
[2166.62] Alex: So, uh, I did first first this batch
[2170.54] Alex: It's it's about minis because i'm making small batches like half thousands
[2175.66] Alex: Six seven hundred pieces at a time. It's quite expensive
[2179.1] Alex: And uh, I got first batch of minis literally yesterday
[2184.3] Alex: 100 pieces just to see it's working
[2186.62] Alex: So because we had to change some some electronics it was hard to get chips
[2191.34] Alex: and uh
[2192.54] Alex: I have a problem because factory forgot to put cables in it and I want to have flight controllers with set of cables you can connect to
[2200.14] Alex: anything you want and uh to
[2203.02] Alex: Well to this one as well
[2205.42] Alex: And I had a dilemma to wait a week till they sent me the cables or to get
[2212.38] Alex: You know stuff to people to start flying this weekend
[2216.14] Alex: And uh, well, I I I have discord now I talked to the guys and they said well
[2220.7] Alex: We we don't mind have some without without cables
[2224.7] Alex: So I just took 20 put it on my store. I run my store now. So
[2229.34] Alex: since last weekend
[2231.02] Alex: Uh, and uh, it's shipped this morning. So, um, I hope tomorrow they will get it and we'll start start flying this weekend
[2238.62] Alex: That would be great
[2240.78] Alex: Next week i'm getting cables. I will repack it and I will send half it to and factory half of it to impulse
[2247.42] Alex: RC so it will be spreaded a little bit on the world. I'm too lazy
[2251.26] Alex: I have no time to just do shipping to overseas. I do only europe
[2255.98] Alex: It's one man show so you need to prioritize stuff. So that's the story. Yeah, I have stock you will have it
[2262.7] Alex: I don't even give uh minis to my uh team pilots from this batch. So everything goes to people
[2269.34] Alex: I have one
[2271.18] Alex: I have one I soldered it. This is the first one I soldered and I it's still my only
[2276.86] Alex: mini
[2278.22] Jack: Yeah
[2280.7] Jack: Caroline mentioned
[2283.02] Jack: uh the the
[2285.26] Jack: The the drac at the back. There you go. Uh mini drac in the background
[2290.54] Jack: You you've even got your pick and place machine. So
[2294.3] Jack: um
[2295.1] Jack: For people unfamiliar like the soldering nerd talk. That's the little machine that sucks components out of those reels
[2303.82] Jack: and uh
[2305.02] Jack: and then places it on top of the uh pcb and then
[2309.42] Jack: Uh, you were saying you built a a reflow oven out of a pizza oven
[2315.26] Jack: so
[2316.86] Jack: Delicious delicious pizza hut. Uh, this this this episode sponsored by pizza hut. It's not really this is not allowed in this oven
[2324.78] Jack: Yeah
[2327.42] Jack: Um, and yeah, you're you're you're flowing your own boards. Um
[2333.42] Jack: Which is credible and you were talking about the minis that have the the smaller, you know, you're now going to bga
[2341.42] Jack: And we were talking
[2343.9] Jack: Put resin around to like glue the the chip in place
[2348.14] Jack: So that's that's quite interesting
[2351.26] Alex: uh, that's uh
[2352.94] Alex: You had your concern about durability of of the bga chips
[2357.74] Alex: The thing is, um, I spoke to quite some engineers and uh about you know, you have bga you have board you crash and
[2366.14] Alex: Sometimes bga chips are going bad
[2369.66] Alex: uh, the thing is
[2371.58] Alex: It's valid. Yeah, if you have big s bga chip
[2374.86] Alex: so it will
[2376.7] Alex: have cracks in the
[2378.86] Alex: In the solar and it will stop working like you probably saw it in the runtime split, uh, runtime splits
[2385.9] Alex: A lot of them are dying because of the chips, but they're chips like this. So
[2390.78] Alex: They're huge
[2392.14] Alex: And usually what what they do, uh on the factory they put a ration, you know
[2396.86] Alex: Black ration around the chips to glue it in actually so maybe so it's uh on the phones
[2402.94] Alex: All the chips are glued. It's no no problem to do that and I was offered to actually do it
[2409.18] Alex: Uh guys said it's eight by eight millimeters chip. It's eight by eight millimeters
[2415.1] Alex: They do this thing with racing about 12 by 12 millimeters. It's pretty much 50 more
[2422.7] Alex: and
[2423.98] Alex: From all the all the ultras that were sold it's a three digit number
[2429.42] Alex: There was no one
[2432.62] Alex: H7 chip just disordered or had a crack in the solder
[2437.9] Jack: None give one to tony. I'm sure he i'm sure he can have a bloody good old guy
[2443.74] Alex: which we dropped at 60 meters on concrete and
[2449.02] Jack: Well, yeah, it's fine hard mounted or the um
[2454.46] Alex: Or soft mounted, you know the rubbery or hard or on very hard
[2460.54] Alex: Rubbers that's the impulse receive sense with the frames. They just easy easy to mount for me this way
[2466.78] Alex: Uh leave you was doing bendo stuff and uh, he crashed a lot
[2472.78] Alex: What damein did that's that was incredible. He he tortured it like there's no tomorrow
[2478.7] Alex: But the guy is crashing if he crash he crash good
[2483.26] Alex: So he said this is last
[2486.04] Alex: Indefinite time longer than race flight. I think I can't complain very good. Yeah
[2491.34] Alex: Yeah
[2492.62] Jack: That's it. Um caroline asked does ultra interface to the dji hd. Yeah
[2500.38] Alex: You can you it does uh interface you have
[2504.14] Alex: Quite a lot of sensor. I think 12 sensors implemented
[2508.06] Alex: And you can move things around if you if you're pleased you can use presets where you can move it around
[2514.62] Alex: It's a bit trickier because uh, I have one osd editor for analog and dji
[2520.06] Alex: You need to use analog osd editor to edit dji location. So
[2525.66] Alex: But it's okay
[2527.5] Jack: All right, uh, right. Let's have a look i've got some
[2531.66] Jack: thing also, uh big up, um, you you're a fan of individual escs
[2537.42] Jack: Um, well, I have some yeah
[2540.3] Jack: So yeah, uh, you released the pdb which was
[2544.7] Jack: a good shout this one
[2547.02] Alex: Yes, it's called project ironman
[2550.54] Jack: Yeah
[2552.54] Jack: I see you all very good
[2554.86] Jack: Um
[2555.74] Jack: What was I going to do? Uh the peak and place machine for development and your prototyping are you?
[2563.66] Jack: Are you still doing that or are you now out of the prototype stage or these and you're just focusing on code or?
[2572.22] Jack: Is there going to be more revisions to the boards?
[2575.1] Alex: Um, it depends on the availability of components at the moment. We have revision five of ultra and revision two of minis
[2583.42] Alex: Uh, we have quite a big stock of components that we need. I think i'm talking thousands
[2588.7] Alex: so
[2589.9] Alex: At the moment there will be no
[2592.22] Alex: No new revisions, but if if I will need one so I can just make a board, you know
[2597.82] Alex: Put it on machine it assembles it in like five minutes
[2600.86] Alex: So pretty cool and
[2604.38] Alex: It's it's like electronic engineering porn you look at this machine that says
[2609.02] Alex: It would took me like six eight hours to do it with a freaking pinset
[2613.42] Jack: Yeah, have you got an optical to tell which direction? Oh, man
[2619.5] Alex: Yeah, that's uh, it has two cameras. It's his
[2622.06] Alex: The top top vision button vision and uh, all the good is
[2627.56] Alex: 0402 uh components. Oh, they're very small and i'm old i'm don't can't really see them to be honest
[2636.62] Jack: Um
[2637.98] Jack: What was I gonna say? Uh
[2640.54] Jack: What yeah, what direction do you plan to go in the future?
[2644.3] Jack: like what is your next big big goal because if you've you know, you've introduced the
[2649.66] Jack: Return to home you've you've introduced the the the vector osd. What what's your next goal now? Is it uh,
[2657.66] Jack: it's like fly better or
[2660.62] Alex: performance
[2663.74] Alex: There's some things that that are
[2666.78] Alex: kiss legacy, so they
[2669.66] Alex: Not really bothering me a lot, but uh, they could be done better
[2674.22] Alex: So that's what i'm planning to do coming coming time actually to to improve and fix that
[2680.38] Alex: that little problems that
[2682.46] Alex: that can be
[2684.14] Alex: better
[2687.26] Tony: Okay, well I I definitely felt a difference between kiss v1 and v2 i'd like to uh
[2693.98] Tony: I'd like to have a break of the ultra. I think especially with the return to home stuff
[2699.98] Alex: Uh, yeah, there there was actually not that not that much difference what um
[2705.66] Alex: There are two difference between v1 and v2 except the processor
[2709.58] Alex: There's uh, i2c and spi bus for for gyro. Of course spi is faster
[2715.66] Alex: and
[2716.7] Alex: Because the cpu is just faster what four times or whatever
[2723.1] Alex: 217
[2724.78] Alex: versus 87
[2726.86] Alex: Don't remember really
[2728.22] Alex: uh, I have adaptive filter that is
[2731.98] Alex: Pretty much 12 times faster than well not faster 12 times better than on f3
[2738.38] Alex: and on fh7
[2741.5] Alex: you have
[2743.34] Alex: Quite a bit of cpu power available to do nice stuff. So it's
[2749.0] Alex: 480 mhertz
[2751.02] Alex: with a quite big caches and uh
[2754.14] Alex: It's it's amazing machine
[2756.14] Alex: It's really amazing. It's so pleasant to work with it. It's it has so many, uh
[2761.98] Alex: interesting, uh, uh
[2764.3] Alex: Well parts or you know devices inside and there's better dma
[2770.38] Alex: I don't care about the speed of the bus. So to be honest, so nobody should
[2776.54] Alex: but uh raw cpu power it's
[2779.58] Alex: crazy
[2780.62] Alex: i'm loading seven what 17 13 17 percent
[2785.98] Alex: with 60 frames per second osd and full blown flight controller on one cpu
[2792.14] Alex: So there's so it's it's crazy
[2795.42] Jack: Yeah
[2796.38] Jack: I was going to say, um
[2798.06] Jack: Did they they must have tweaked something?
[2800.78] Jack: um
[2801.82] Jack: With like between kiss v1 and v2
[2805.1] Jack: There was definitely
[2806.78] Jack: a change for the yaw
[2809.58] Jack: I don't know like
[2812.46] Alex: Same code
[2814.14] Alex: Exactly the same. Yeah, exactly the same code. I I don't remember anything related
[2819.58] Alex: To to yo, uh, basically you have uh, you have low level codes that is uh
[2826.22] Alex: For f3 f7 h7 g4, whatever and you have uh your flight code and usually flight code is the same for all of them except well
[2835.74] Alex: Adaptive field for example
[2837.74] Alex: It's just two different filters
[2840.94] Alex: Can't work
[2842.3] Alex: Uh, and um, yeah, I don't know it filters better
[2847.34] Alex: That's that make uh can make a difference. Uh cpu load make a lot of difference in flight
[2853.9] Alex: it does
[2855.42] Alex: It's it stupidly does the faster you do the more actual
[2859.5] Alex: Uh value of gyro you have and more faster motor response you got
[2864.7] Alex: We try to h7 with just exactly the same freeware as f7
[2869.42] Alex: It's like freaking day and night
[2871.98] Alex: You you you feel this connection. So it's everyone says like
[2876.7] Alex: Uh f7 you have brain hand squad
[2880.46] Alex: With h7 you have brain squad
[2883.5] Alex: It's
[2884.62] Alex: It's just faster. I don't know how to explain it. It well, I know how to explain it will be very long explanation
[2891.66] Jack: um
[2892.7] Jack: qz, uh
[2895.26] Jack: fpv
[2896.3] Jack: Says the only downside flying quick kiss
[2899.66] Jack: For me is the anti-gravity is not there. I'm working right now
[2904.22] Alex: You're working on it. Yeah, I work on it because
[2908.22] Alex: There are some pieces I already did actually in the b20 and b22 frameworks
[2913.66] Alex: It's it's a bit better, but i'm not happy about it
[2916.46] Alex: So it will be implemented
[2918.7] Alex: So I it's I think it's one of the top of my list
[2923.02] Alex: It annoys me and the thing is what what happens now?
[2926.7] Alex: Because uh, better flight for three fixed it finally and now they everyone's like comparing everything to better flight
[2933.9] Alex: It's like we did it. Did you?
[2937.9] Jack: All right
[2940.54] Jack: Is it is kind of mad like and also
[2943.66] Jack: Am I am I right in saying them that the the kiss ultra interfaces?
[2948.7] Jack: Uh with um the biielli and biielli vassary
[2952.7] Jack: Is that right like?
[2955.98] Alex: Thank you
[2959.9] Alex: To actually write this code and sniff the protocol
[2962.94] Alex: Unfortunately, there's not much documentation available from bill helity but they helped
[2968.3] Alex: Yeah, I spoke with scout. I spoke with other guy. What was his name? I don't remember it was a year now
[2974.54] Alex: and uh, yeah, actually
[2976.86] Alex: It works with all bill helis you have passed through you even have the message
[2982.7] Alex: On osd that is bill heli pass through active when you do that. It's just a little things
[2988.62] Alex: But yeah, it works
[2990.78] Jack: No, I was um, any questions guys put it in the chat last 10 minutes is always over to you. Um
[2997.5] Jack: A couple in there. Hang on. Yeah, hello
[3000.62] Jack: Will you increase production?
[3002.94] Alex: No, I don't I don't slowly. I know
[3006.3] Jack: uh, please send some to uh
[3009.58] Jack: The there's a company hobby rc in uh in the uk like
[3014.54] Jack: That would be amazing
[3016.46] Alex: It's like you have a two dealers that will have 50 percent of budget or three dealers that will have 30 percent of badges
[3022.54] Alex: Yeah, well, it will be sold again in uh, what end factory was selling it, uh, like four ultras a minute
[3030.3] Alex: Last time
[3032.22] Alex: It's yeah, it's cost quite fast
[3035.26] Tony: Yeah, I think someone in the chat said that um
[3039.5] Tony: Who was using it van over was starting to use kiss
[3044.46] Tony: It probably start getting you know, he's more popular now because
[3048.78] Tony: You know someone like that flies it everyone's going to want to try it, aren't they?
[3053.74] Alex: I don't really offer ultra to any pilots. They usually come and ask
[3058.62] Alex: so i'm
[3059.82] Alex: deliberately not not pushing it so damien asked and uh, he
[3065.02] Alex: Made me to improve some things for him. Yeah of an overasked title
[3070.38] Alex: Um, even bard will ask a few days back. No, I really yeah. Yeah, I sent I sent him a couple so
[3076.86] Alex: I hope you will enjoy it really for like, merry christmas
[3081.02] Jack: No, it's uh, chris davis. There's um
[3084.38] Jack: Not a question, but just opportunity to say thank you alex for the ultra
[3088.86] Jack: It's been truly incredible and has been brilliant to use lots of big tv jobs here in the uk
[3094.46] Jack: Well, oh chris you're from the uk. Hello, my friend
[3100.94] Jack: Mike x says also you can now have current sensor with biheli 32
[3107.18] Alex: Don't you start
[3109.74] Alex: That's the problem bill heli has no good support of this shot
[3113.26] Alex: The shot telemetry it's they they just sent
[3116.22] Alex: not really good values back
[3119.18] Alex: and uh
[3120.22] Alex: Yeah, bard will
[3121.74] Jack: But shady shady's a legend in the chat. He's he's one of the old school and uh
[3128.78] Jack: Yeah, um, we've seen zero in the chat as well. Richard warrick
[3134.06] Jack: Um, some really good faces in there as well. That's a lot once taz fbv hasn't been in the tailspin. Thank you. Yeah, totally
[3142.86] Jack: uh
[3144.14] Jack: Did kiss fork from
[3146.52] Jack: myco
[3148.02] Jack: Copter is that right me
[3150.66] Alex: Ro copter micro cop. I have no freaking idea. I didn't start kiss felix did with yeah
[3157.46] Jack: And now he's working on um fat tech
[3161.14] Jack: Yeah
[3162.18] Jack: so, you know
[3163.7] Alex: Good luck
[3165.14] Jack: yeah, if you got do you want to plug your
[3168.1] Jack: uh, do you want to plug some of your patreon and
[3172.18] Jack: And everything in your shop and uh, I could paste in the discord as well
[3178.58] Jack: the disc
[3179.86] Alex: I don't have links with me. So I need to look around but
[3183.22] Alex: Uh all the links basically are available in the gooey and just kiss ultra.com and you have web gooey
[3189.22] Alex: So you don't need to install it and uh on the bottom line you have patreon facebook, uh discord
[3195.62] Alex: Native gooey's shop will be in the next version. So it's it's all there. So it doesn't doesn't need to be mentioned
[3203.06] Jack: So let's have a look. Have I got any
[3205.94] Jack: Other things I can ask
[3209.54] Jack: Yeah, have you flown peter flight lately
[3212.74] Alex: No
[3213.78] Jack: You haven't
[3215.22] Alex: No a couple of years ago. I tried to uh configure one of a friend of mine. I failed miserably
[3221.78] Alex: No
[3223.3] Alex: But no seriously, I I couldn't
[3226.74] Alex: So what's going on, isn't it?
[3228.74] Tony: It's simple
[3230.34] Alex: You need to be freaking rocket scientists to do that
[3232.74] Alex: So like I don't know what's pt1 filter and I know what pt1 filter is
[3237.14] Alex: What pt2 filter where you put need to put it combine it and then you have uh,
[3242.66] Alex: It's complicated. It's it's great. It's very advanced. You can do whatever you want to do, but some people just want to fly
[3251.06] Jack: Um, how did you get into um coding?
[3256.74] Jack: and
[3257.86] Jack: developing general
[3259.86] Alex: I took coding since I was like 13 or 14 years old
[3265.3] Alex: uh
[3266.26] Alex: in
[3267.94] Alex: 1996 there was uh
[3270.66] Alex: Uh, i'm from russia, you know, there's computers. It's it's very
[3274.64] Alex: Obstructing and was not available in uh in 80s and but in uh 86 there was a post in
[3281.52] Alex: Electronic magazine how to make your own computer
[3284.82] Alex: And this is how it started so they post it in a year
[3287.7] Alex: You need to buy components why by one then you get pcb you need to solder it and you need to program it and it was
[3294.82] Alex: I was like 14 at that time
[3297.38] Alex: It's well some people just trying to catch girls, but uh, well probably I just was too nerdy
[3303.86] Alex: Um, yeah, and this is how I started to program in machine code without any interpreter or anything
[3310.82] Alex: I still remember like cd. It's call in assembly or c9. It's return
[3315.62] Alex: So this is how you code machine codes right away
[3319.46] Alex: color
[3323.94] Jack: Um, what okay what gear do you use? Sorry, what gear do you use? Uh
[3332.74] Jack: Goggles are you because you left the team fail safe?
[3336.82] Alex: Of goggles, uh, I think
[3340.32] Alex: dominators two and three, uh, whatever the latest somebody said somebody was
[3347.12] Alex: Present hdo3 or two. What's the latest? Yeah
[3350.5] Alex: Uh, I have ggi, uh, I have uh,
[3355.38] Alex: Uh shark bites
[3358.1] Alex: Uh radios I have uh there I think uh mambo I bought two to check the latest what uh, trappy is doing
[3366.66] Jack: Uh, they had to pull the uh latest update for the manbo
[3371.38] Jack: So they're they're they're redoing
[3375.62] Alex: Yeah, I know I know I don't uh radio master tango two, uh tango one
[3382.9] Alex: Old trusted tyrannis still working. Yeah, like very old. Uh, what else?
[3388.98] Alex: drones everything that's uh
[3391.06] Alex: Impulsor c is doing sean is very kind and he sends all all carbon stuff. He makes uh to me just
[3397.86] Jack: I don't know that guy
[3399.86] Alex: He's uh, yeah, it's a nice guy
[3401.62] Alex: He's uh, I said like sean can I use the shape for this because I like it
[3405.22] Alex: He said like here's the dxf knock yourself out. Oh, what a legend
[3409.62] Jack: Yeah, yeah, that's really him and will look after me so much
[3414.74] Alex: Is actually his uh helped me a lot to start with osd. So
[3420.34] Alex: Quite some things uh was taken from his design
[3423.62] Alex: And quite some things changed of course, but basic was was uh, was what sean is doing on his osd
[3431.22] Alex: It's not that actually complicated, but uh, well, I never did it before so to start tomorrow
[3437.3] Jack: Yeah, um, yeah shady. Yeah, uh, the case ultra has osd built in
[3442.74] Jack: So
[3443.7] Alex: Kiss ultra eat this osd. It's one thing
[3447.06] Jack: Yeah, same same chip doing two things. It's same trip. Yes
[3452.26] Jack: flying and showing you things, um
[3455.7] Jack: Please like how much you have to pay to do ghost
[3459.94] Jack: ghost lure
[3461.62] Jack: Sorry, the the ghost lure script for kiss
[3465.7] Alex: Uh, is there any support available? I don't know. I don't think there is I the last time I left there wasn't
[3471.78] Alex: I I they sent me they sent me a set with a protocol description, but there is no no parameters
[3478.18] Alex: You can change it's just only a few packets with a payload of the six. That's it
[3483.94] Alex: That's what I did. Sorry guys. Can't do anymore. Maybe if maybe there's there's a date, but they didn't send me anything
[3490.58] Jack: okay, i'll
[3493.7] Alex: Why would you want to have lower street lower script because
[3497.46] Alex: Only if you have hd if you're an analog on ultra actually you can do a configuration of all crossfire connected devices just from osd
[3507.14] Jack: Yeah, I yeah
[3509.14] Jack: Obviously i'm not running
[3512.1] Jack: Yeah, I don't know I just like I I like the setting it with the you know going through the tyrannis
[3520.02] Jack: Yeah, I don't know. I just I would like that. Oh, yes, you know old habits
[3525.46] Jack: Yeah, um, are there any um projects like um edge tx or
[3532.18] Jack: You know, uh express lrs that you follow and you're interested in uh, yeah
[3537.94] Alex: I quite interested in express lrs nice project. Uh, quite smart people there
[3543.78] Alex: I I have set up and i'm testing it actually on daily based on all releases. I do
[3548.9] Alex: uh
[3549.78] Alex: One guy from canada just sent me sent me said he has like also fanatic about express lrs. I don't really like
[3557.62] Alex: A user friendliness a little bit of of the system
[3560.74] Alex: Probably they they need to grow a little bit and think about people how they use it updating is like
[3565.94] Alex: I don't like it should be more more nice to like itb as does uh, but uh in general, it's it's quite cool
[3572.98] Jack: no, right chip too
[3575.46] Jack: Mqz fpv asked do you fly the impulse?
[3579.22] Jack: RC apex as a frame. Yep
[3582.02] Alex: Epic apex aliens reverb
[3585.06] Alex: And some other thing i'm not supposed to talk about
[3588.18] Alex: No worries
[3589.86] Jack: Um and taz fpvrs is the kiss?
[3593.7] Jack: Keychain still available and is it compatible with ultra? Yes, and yes
[3599.38] Alex: Excellent. I did two weeks ago. I did updates or guys took a bit longer than I expected because i'm
[3604.98] Alex: Was busy with ultra. It's fully support. Uh
[3608.9] Alex: ultra
[3610.34] Alex: and
[3611.14] Alex: Fatek kiss whatever was before so it's uh, yeah two mode compatible
[3616.42] Alex: Uh only one thing. Yeah, it's great for dji people so they can change everything without without
[3622.74] Alex: An hour goes d
[3624.42] Alex: Pity for them, but this is the way
[3627.14] Jack: Too late
[3629.14] Jack: Maybe who knows?
[3630.74] Jack: Um guys, that is all we've got time for
[3634.5] Jack: You've been listening to the lecture now, uh massive shout out to our patreons who keep this show running. Um, and uh
[3643.46] Jack: Guys, thank you so much. Uh, we will keep following this project. It's uh as a as a as a kiss. Um
[3651.54] Jack: Kiss family for a very long time
[3653.54] Jack: I uh, this is super exciting for me and i've i love talking to you and thank you so much for showing me your cat earlier
[3661.78] Jack: Um, and that is that has made my day
[3664.9] Jack: Um, he is a beautiful boy. Uh, please. Um
[3669.22] Jack: I I might even send you some dreamies to feed to him
[3674.98] Alex: You know, he's just alive because of kiss community
[3679.3] Alex: Really? Yeah, he has almost died and uh, he had his when he was like seven eight months old
[3685.86] Alex: And uh, he had to go to the
[3689.06] Alex: university
[3690.02] Alex: Well, he was about to die
[3691.78] Alex: And the price for saving him was like 6k
[3695.3] Alex: and uh, I I well, I was a little bit in problems at that time and I was about to sell the car for it and
[3701.46] Alex: I just dropped a message on facebook
[3703.78] Alex: And uh, I think in one evening we had a amount collected
[3708.66] Alex: Really really great for all the kiss piles amazing and he's still alive. He's eight years old and
[3714.34] Alex: Brilliant eight and a half kilo
[3717.06] Jack: Nice. Yeah, he's a big beautiful boy. Thank you
[3720.74] Jack: to everyone
[3722.02] Jack: Uh, yeah, all the kiss community we we're
[3726.02] Jack: We're great. We're together keeping stuff simple easy to use
[3730.74] Jack: You know, uh, i've been uh bright until I fly
[3735.22] Jack: Alex has joined us
[3738.66] Jack: Um and uh my darling wife tony
[3742.26] Jack: And
[3744.26] Jack: Thank you. Good night
[3746.9] Alex: Hi guys. Thanks for having me
[3748.9] Jack: It's been a pleasure
[3750.5] Jack: just
[3751.7] Alex: telemetry lost