=== Let's Drone Out — Episode 376 ===
Title: LDO 376 - Seagulls cost more than you think
Recorded: 2022-11-10
Hosts: Wayne "CurryKitten" Andrews, Stephen "Belrik" Howell, Jack "Brightontillifly" Nash, Andrew "Frank" Hyams
Guest(s): (none recorded)
Total audience: 1,816
Platforms: YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NycKZJhfd0); SoundCloud (http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/1381606234-letsdroneout-ldo-376-seagulls-cost-more-than-you-think.mp3)
=====================================

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[0.0] Jack: Hello and you're listening to what's drawn out and special thank you to our lovely patrons that help donate
[7.48] Jack: So that we could pay the editor to remove the swear words and silly things we say
[12.56] Jack: Massive. Thank you to call us campus art folk now Sam Dharma on with the show
[51.58] Curry: Hello we are live it's ldo it's episode
[55.82] Curry: 376 yes, we're still going and edging ever closer to 400 you will notice
[62.06] Curry: We are down to the dynamic duo tonight because some idiot has asked Jack to be his best man
[68.62] Curry: And you know he gets all he deserves so Jack is off
[72.22] Curry: trying to brave the m25 and getting through all the
[75.78] Curry: loonies protesting
[77.7] Curry: See if he can make it over to his friend's wedding
[79.9] Curry: So it is just myself everyone's favorite curry kitten although clearly not because no one turn up except for Steven who's over the
[87.5] Stephen: Everyone's a favorite Steven with a silly man. He brought amazing moustache with him
[93.14] Curry: Which is great stuff and we're coming into a week. I don't know how it's been for you, Steven
[98.82] Curry: You know a million miles away from me, but in my area of the woods it has been to rent your downpours and
[105.46] Curry: Sort of 40 50 mile an hour wind absolutely awful some of the worst weather I've seen for a long time
[112.26] Stephen: Yeah, it was the sort of weather where I thought oh, we're breaking the clouds the Sun's come out
[116.3] Stephen: Oh, it might it looks like that the pavements dried a bit
[118.82] Stephen: And I go and try and walk around the park and like almost slide over and fall on my ass in the first 20 yards
[124.26] Stephen: So yeah, it's not great for flying. I don't think and there's already standing water on the field where I usually fly so
[131.78] Stephen: discouraging me a little bit
[133.78] Curry: That's the thing is that this is the time of year and it's looking better tomorrow. I've actually got
[138.74] Curry: Batteries charged up and one of the problems I have I don't know about you is after I haven't flown for a while
[143.7] Curry: There's been like at least three weeks for me
[146.1] Curry: aside from like
[148.26] Curry: forgetting how to in like not really remembering what it's like I also have like
[153.46] Curry: Projects built up and it's to the point that I can only take
[156.5] Curry: Half of what I've got ready to fly with me and this means that I'm taking far too much stuff like there's about
[163.14] Curry: 20 batteries coming with me two radios two goggles three models
[168.02] Curry: And a backpack. I won't be able to carry and if anybody
[171.54] Curry: Knows the field that I fly in which looks very nice during the summer and or green
[175.86] Curry: If you looked at it last winter, you're like, why are you flying over a lake and it's not that is the field
[180.74] Curry: The field just holds this water together
[183.14] Curry: So if you don't take off and land in the exact place
[186.66] Curry: You are digging a quad out of slurry essentially because it's that that field is is 90% cow poo
[193.78] Curry: Let's face it
[195.14] Stephen: Yeah, I I don't have cows
[197.14] Stephen: But what I do have is an area that's basically marshland
[201.3] Stephen: And it just fills up with water exactly the same i've also been gathering things. I have
[206.42] Stephen: Since we last spoke
[208.34] Stephen: I think might put this in the last show. I have
[211.38] Stephen: a strange winged contrivance
[214.18] Stephen: Oh, he's got it. Oh, we don't know exactly what's going on there
[217.22] Stephen: But it seems to have wings and I got a receiver for that. Hello jack
[221.78] Stephen: the flaming woofler
[223.62] Curry: It seems to be what you're doing here. I just I just talked to you up a storm about how you couldn't come
[227.94] Curry: You're supposed to be not a drinker
[231.94] Stephen: Big old crew
[233.94] Jack: um
[234.82] Jack: Yeah, i'm gonna i'll leave half past but sorry i'm a little light
[239.38] Jack: I had to get some to eat. That's okay. We weren't expecting right. We we thought you weren't here at all
[244.5] Curry: No, I couldn't
[246.42] Jack: I felt sorry for you guys. Admittedly. I could have left earlier, but
[251.06] Jack: You know, there's only it's only us three hardcore blokes now
[255.7] Stephen: I'm making you a thing jack. This is an express lrs joystick adapter. It takes a usbc. I'll put a cable in there
[262.9] Stephen: So that it's glued you can't quite see how badly it's made from this distance
[267.3] Stephen: But it's not held in with any sort of fancy clips. No, i've used glue. Um
[273.22] Stephen: It's fairly easy to remove glue. It's my favorite welder brand glue that I use for absolutely everything but isn't the lesson glued
[279.94] Jack: Thank you. I very much appreciate it. Um
[283.3] Jack: I fixed
[285.22] Jack: this
[287.96] Jack: Uh, the isd now works for now you put the smoke back in
[292.92] Jack: That's exceptional
[294.28] Jack: I've got to figure out how to power the transmitter up to you know
[299.56] Stephen: How do you put smoke inside a chip
[302.36] Jack: Uh, I didn't smoke it. It was well, it was
[306.36] Jack: It was smoking a little bit, but there was a short
[312.28] Jack: On the video so it's probably done nothing any good
[316.92] Jack: So sorry, what was shorting you just uh linked power pins or something?
[321.08] Jack: Yeah power pin to the video pen on the btx side
[325.16] Jack: That's got a zing. I know so
[328.84] Jack: yeah, I think I think the um
[334.76] Jack: I'm guessing
[336.68] Jack: It just because it wasn't full on negative it didn't
[341.32] Jack: It didn't completely short and blow clear and maybe that's good because it was because it was a bit of a george michael
[348.28] Jack: You know careless whisker. Um
[351.32] Jack: I'm thinking not much current could get through and that's how everything survived
[357.16] Stephen: Well, excellent to hear that. Yeah, jack and I were we're meddling away on on discord looking at this the other day and
[363.8] Stephen: Went back to beta flight 3.2. I think we were on
[368.44] Stephen: just
[369.4] Stephen: tooling around trying to see what would work and what wouldn't
[372.36] Stephen: And went as far as building a custom build of beta flight for this weird old quad
[378.6] Stephen: I've got quite intrigued by it
[381.56] Jack: Yeah, it should be quite an experience. I'm hoping that maybe you know next year we can sort of like all meet up and
[389.0] Jack: uh, you know sort of present this to two people to fly
[395.0] Jack: And you know kind of have fun with
[397.88] Jack: And just talk about the good old days. I mean there's no
[401.48] Jack: There's no d shot. There's no
[405.4] Jack: filters
[407.0] Jack: There's nothing, you know, you uh, you were talking b.l. Hely s
[411.8] Jack: And i'm talking b.l. Hely
[414.12] Stephen: Yeah, it's got like lane esc's on there
[416.76] Stephen: It's it's going to be really rough because it won't be able to control the motors that fast at all
[422.2] Curry: And this is where I say things like luxury back in my day. We didn't have d shot
[427.56] Curry: We just had wet gravel. This this is one of the ones i'm flying tomorrow. I decided to see how how i'm doing for my
[434.6] Curry: 10 years and this isn't quite 10 years old the tricopteris, but this is as I found out is running cling flight 1.9
[442.76] Curry: Which is awesome and is essentially just a bundle of wires stuck in a frame
[448.04] Stephen: By the blades clive you're lucky
[451.32] Curry: Zero zero angle on that camera
[454.76] Curry: This is going to be fun. This is a proper board camera
[458.36] Curry: Yeah, it's the the old he's at old 420
[462.04] Curry: Geez man, why wouldn't
[464.04] Jack: What I wouldn't give to get one of those
[466.36] Jack: But you have to break off the circuit board to make it small enough to fit
[471.56] Curry: Oh that that was that was something that came after this and when I took it off
[476.76] Curry: I opened it up to see what was in there
[478.92] Curry: So I was making a video about this and essentially it was just bits of glue and wire stuck together
[484.84] Curry: All in this big lump and I had to like unpear all this glue to find out what was under it
[489.56] Curry: And try and find the osd
[492.2] Curry: It was it was quite nasty
[494.28] Stephen: Surrendous absolutely horrendous. I was half tempted to get one of these nmr 250 frames and just
[500.12] Stephen: Chuck, um, some my flight zing 2 motors on an h7 flight controller and just yolo it and see what it could do
[507.0] Jack: it's pointless doing that in a way because
[511.24] Jack: the arms are
[513.0] Jack: literally like bits of
[515.48] Jack: fantastic
[516.6] Jack: yeah, you know like my
[519.16] Jack: This is a top plate for
[521.8] Jack: um
[522.68] Jack: a
[523.72] Stephen: Yeah, I suppose you need to hold it back to something like 1806 motors
[527.16] Jack: If you're any bigger than that, it just vibrates itself to pieces. Yeah, the the top plate of a
[533.38] Jack: Apex is the same thickness
[537.32] Stephen: As the actual two millimeter two millimeter arms. Wow
[541.88] Jack: Yeah, something like that and that is a new you know, like that's an apex which is like five
[547.88] Stephen: That's that's thinner than my three and a half inch quad frame
[552.04] Jack: That three and a half has got three mil arms. It's awful. I mean, this is this has been beefed up
[559.0] Jack: You know with the use of the pdb
[561.72] Jack: But you know like this, you know, it's not even the full
[565.96] Jack: You don't even get a full bottom plate with this version
[569.24] Stephen: I suppose that's where the hot glue came in to reduce resonance, right?
[572.44] Stephen: You had to just like caulk it up with hot glue to absorb the vibration
[576.92] Jack: Yeah, it was uh, well we we we weren't even that advanced then
[582.28] Jack: Like I like curry's approach because he has got period correct stuff
[587.32] Jack: And it's like a snapshot of
[590.28] Jack: And the past
[592.04] Curry: But you know, that's because I haven't changed it
[594.84] Curry: It wasn't it wasn't sort of rebuilt for this. This is just something that sat on the wall
[599.48] Curry: Being nostalgic a bit like the tricopter. I did find our last touch the tricopter five years ago
[605.8] Curry: Just to see how it flew and it didn't fly very well. So now I've had to sort of
[609.8] Curry: Revise how to set up the kk2 or something. Didn't you break a motor off?
[616.04] Curry: Yeah when it was um
[618.76] Curry: Because the tricopter is big I had it
[621.24] Curry: I've unfolded on the floor so I could try and work out how to arm it because it was stick arming
[625.0] Curry: I couldn't remember what the stick positions were
[627.96] Curry: And when I was walking out the door, I sort of tripped over it and one of the motors got snapped off the legs
[634.52] Curry: Which is uh
[635.72] Curry: Slightly embarrassing but they are just held on with zip ties. So or cable ties would be cool to me
[640.12] Curry: So I just got some more cable ties and put it back on
[643.72] Curry: All sorted
[646.42] Stephen: It occurs to me that this quad that jack's building is kind of like grandpa having a classic sports car in the garage
[652.74] Stephen: And they just sort of polish it and build it and get it just so
[656.66] Stephen: Then maybe one day a year they take it out drive it 500 yards and back
[661.38] Jack: Yeah, we we would kind of do in that with frank because frank had
[667.7] Jack: You know before um
[670.58] Jack: Something changed in beta heli where I can't actually flash
[677.06] Jack: uh the
[679.14] Jack: uh
[680.02] Jack: These
[681.22] Jack: God, what were they like?
[682.82] Jack: Emax 12 amp eses I flashed those so they could you know
[688.1] Jack: Like you change the boot loaders. You can actually flash
[691.14] Jack: Beta heli onto them, but I just couldn't seem to get it to work
[696.18] Jack: Anymore which sucked
[698.18] Curry: But was this using the old style of flashing where you had to disassemble the ec and sold all the
[704.18] Curry: Wires to it and then use that's that's the proper flashing, isn't it? That's when you knew you were doing something special
[709.54] Jack: I think i've still got
[711.54] Jack: that
[712.58] Jack: Said dfc because like I kind of I kind of left it thinking do you know what one day?
[720.02] Jack: You know one day
[721.7] Jack: I'll do that
[723.38] Jack: And I kind of left like what I can only class as like little breadcrumbs
[729.62] Jack: For me myself so that when I came
[733.14] Jack: back to to actually do
[735.86] Jack: You know make my own zmr
[738.9] Jack: You know before the the old parts disappeared, but yeah, that was
[742.66] Jack: You know the old aduino and you used to have to
[746.66] Jack: To fly I just couldn't I couldn't seem to get it to work
[750.26] Curry: Yeah, I think I did the same thing. I think I think these are
[754.26] Curry: the plush escs which I managed to
[757.06] Curry: Flash to be a be a heli and this is the original be a heli and it doesn't really actually do much
[763.14] Curry: I think it might it might stop the motors when you go to zero throttle, which isn't very useful because there's no air mode
[770.02] Curry: Back then so if you just took your throttle down, it would just fall out of the sky. I've got to say jackson attempts to
[776.82] Stephen: Get bill heli up and running
[779.3] Stephen: With pwm mode did not inspire confidence because there was a lot of is it is it going to set the correct endpoints?
[786.98] Stephen: Oh, it doesn't seem to have done that. Oh, oh no, it's spinning. Oh, I seem to have set
[791.62] Stephen: Seem to set minimum throttle as 2000. Oh, oh wait now. It's not running now. It is. Oh now there's smoke
[799.06] Jack: It's just
[802.98] Jack: There is there is an old wrote a write episode where you know, like they're
[807.94] Jack: they're
[809.54] Jack: interviewing sharp who and it's at the
[812.98] Jack: you know, like the
[815.14] Jack: When schizo won the freestyle it's that place where they kind of like built like
[822.18] Jack: towers out of
[824.5] Jack: um
[825.78] Jack: like little gantries and that and
[828.82] Jack: cut a long story short
[831.14] Jack: We had a bug at one point where you were if you plugged your quad in
[836.58] Jack: to the configurator
[838.58] Jack: And you hadn't removed your props
[841.46] Jack: It just went to like full throttle
[844.66] Jack: Uh, and that was that was a thing for a while, but he he had he had that where
[852.58] Jack: That happened and it was just on full power and
[857.46] Jack: The other thing was like props back in the day would break
[861.7] Jack: and um
[863.54] Jack: So you'd you know, luckily like you could kind of like, you know, they would snap
[868.1] Jack: and the thing wouldn't properly take off
[870.82] Jack: but
[872.1] Jack: It was that point where blades
[875.06] Jack: were now, um
[876.9] Jack: the indestructible blades
[878.98] Jack: so
[879.94] Jack: it
[881.7] Jack: Started up throttled up and then you they were just trying to kick it like, you know
[886.18] Jack: They were like killing it like it was like some sort of wild animal
[890.42] Jack: Trying to kill them and uh, it was put foot on the thing and yoink
[894.82] Jack: Yeah, man, you couldn't get anywhere near it like
[898.74] Jack: It was uh, it was terrible
[901.78] Jack: Yeah
[903.46] Curry: Again, it's fun when things go wrong. I think there's still a video for and I think it's just from rc shin
[908.5] Curry: Where he had he'd done a flight on some sort of quad
[912.02] Curry: And he'd he'd landed it and he could not get it to disarm
[916.02] Curry: So because it was it was sort of bouncing as well
[918.9] Curry: And then you got some guy coming on with a broom trying to bash it down and and trying it like someone's trying to reach
[924.5] Curry: Under to get the battery plug really good video fun to watch
[928.34] Jack: When when things go crazy, I just yeah, I don't know. It's like, uh,
[933.62] Jack: You know the retro the retro quad build, you know kind of like going
[938.82] Jack: Going back to it
[942.02] Stephen: Yeah, I can see the appeal i'm just i'm so used to
[945.06] Stephen: like quads that you can just like
[947.86] Stephen: Wail on you know, push them to full throttle flip them upside down like what what?
[952.9] Stephen: I think it was you or someone else's complaining because I kept doing it when we were meeting up by the by the towers
[958.58] Stephen: And then just like hurling over our heads keeping the camera tracking on us and just like
[964.66] Stephen: Inverting at the midway point and then just like wait till i'm about foot above the ground and jam the throttle and just stop dead and then
[971.86] Stephen: Punch out and do exactly the opposite thing in an arc over our heads
[975.62] Stephen: uh, so i've got lots of good footage at the top of our heads as I sort of like
[979.22] Stephen: Punched out in uh in orbits like go describing semi-circles over our heads
[985.14] Stephen: And i'm just not sure whether i'd feel confident doing that type of flying with these quads
[989.54] Stephen: Don't worry me you talk about them. I think you've had to really adjust the style of flying and just tame everything down a lot
[997.22] Curry: He would like that one i've got only runs on 3s
[1000.9] Curry: And it's pretty heavy and so you have to think if you go into a dive
[1005.54] Curry: You have to go full throttle about three seconds
[1009.38] Curry: Before you normally would because there's such like a hang on thinking about it thinking about it thinking about it
[1015.14] Curry: Coming back up slowly slowly. So oh just missed the ground luckily
[1019.06] Curry: So all maneuvers were done very high
[1021.94] Curry: And the throttle wasn't dropped because then the props would just stop and he'd fall
[1026.58] Curry: It was very different
[1028.18] (VT): Yikes
[1029.38] Jack: Yeah, here you go. I found I found the video
[1032.82] Jack: We'll probably get a um
[1035.22] Jack: Wobble copter
[1036.66] Jack: Yeah, we'll probably get a channel channel strike. No doubt but
[1041.78] Jack: for what
[1042.82] Jack: um
[1044.1] Jack: Will it will it use?
[1046.1] Jack: Will it play it?
[1047.46] Stephen: If it's 20 seconds around here, I believe that's fair fair you
[1051.06] (VT): Can you hear it?
[1053.06] (VT): Yeah, yeah, I know what i'm doing. I'm sharper
[1058.66] (VT): So then so then we plug it into the computer
[1063.6] (VT): 2000 to set it to calibration mode
[1066.34] (VT): It goes off the ground
[1068.58] (VT): And I just remember going like
[1070.98] (VT): Like this and the thing is coming towards me
[1073.62] (VT): And I keep going because I was with two friends
[1076.58] (VT): They're looking at me going like this and i'm going like this with the quad
[1080.1] (VT): Then they come in and we start kicking it. I managed to push it and then
[1085.06] (VT): Sergio was wearing yeah when you close her out flip flops. So he's going like this
[1092.42] (VT): He wants his step on it he doesn't want to lose his toes so then I so then I managed to like literally
[1099.14] (VT): It's not stopping moving because i'm using the doll props because they're not breaking
[1104.42] (VT): The props are not breaking and it didn't cut my finger on my leg and it didn't broke they kept spinning. So we start kicking it
[1111.62] (VT): Literally kicking it. We were killing an animal at that point
[1118.18] Jack: It was yeah, it was it was like that back in the day
[1121.94] Jack: I mean you
[1123.3] Jack: You had you had a like little
[1126.42] Jack: little taste of that with me, you know being like
[1130.98] Jack: You know like hearing the ese calibrating stuff and
[1136.82] Jack: Uh when when i'm setting up my quads
[1139.78] Jack: it
[1141.06] Jack: It wouldn't save and reboot. It would just save
[1144.74] Jack: So then you had to go to the cli and then exit the cli and it would reboot. So me and steven are like
[1153.3] Stephen: Trying to trying to change the board orientation and we're like, yeah, what the hell is going on?
[1157.62] Stephen: It's not changing. We're changing like zero 90 180 270. It's not making a blind bit of difference. What's going on here?
[1164.42] Curry: Hmm
[1165.54] Stephen: And and then we go to the ports jab and he's like you're gonna like this and that there's only two ports
[1170.1] Stephen: There's no usb vcp. It doesn't exist. It's an f103. It doesn't yeah, apparently doesn't do it
[1176.18] Jack: He was like, why don't you use another you are I was like, there is no other you are
[1181.94] Jack: We are using all you aren't
[1184.82] Jack: And like we're using both of them
[1187.14] Stephen: Yeah, one of those we need for the usb port mate, so we can either have usb port or osd. All right
[1193.7] Jack: Yeah, nothing else. Like yeah, yeah, and he's just like what?
[1198.34] Jack: and
[1199.14] Jack: The the whole idea of that, you know, like usb was never
[1203.7] Jack: That accessible you kind of just used to set it up and leave it. There's a whole idea is you plug
[1210.34] Jack: Into the quad
[1212.66] Jack: Through the back of the quad. I don't know what he was thinking
[1217.3] Jack: You know, like you kind of had a
[1219.14] Jack: A board on top kind of like where you get to and then underslung batteries or something. I don't know. It's
[1226.1] Stephen: It's like a cp102 like a separate chip that does usb to serial. It's like having a
[1232.74] Stephen: An ftdi basically built onto the board. It's not incorporated in any way
[1238.26] Stephen: Absolutely nuts and I was looking at the f303 and thinking oh, maybe now we've got cloud builds for beta flight
[1244.9] Stephen: Maybe I can like carve off enough features to do an f3 build
[1248.74] Stephen: Didn't manage to set up the libraries and peripheral drivers
[1252.26] Stephen: Properly to do it might get there eventually, but yeah, this thing's got 128k of flash
[1258.5] Stephen: And that release they decided that they were going to disable esc pass through
[1263.78] Stephen: So that they could keep like barometer support
[1266.58] Stephen: It's like that little memory that it was either be able to read a barometer or do the bl heli pass through
[1273.94] Stephen: But there's just no no space on that chip whatsoever
[1277.38] Stephen: So yeah, I found the the board defines and I did a custom build and I disabled barometer and re-enabled the esc pass through
[1285.06] Stephen: Got that working, but
[1286.98] Stephen: Oh my word. It's just there's no
[1290.02] Stephen: No, no, it's not enough hardware to really do anything at that point. It's it's nuts
[1295.7] Jack: Is is like that, you know, like I remember when
[1300.4] Jack: f3 boards come out and it was just like
[1305.22] Jack: You know, we they they honestly believed that
[1309.14] Jack: Why you know, why would you need anything else?
[1312.02] Jack: You know, you've got you've got enough room
[1314.5] Jack: There's so much room for activities
[1317.46] Stephen: You look at dynamic filters and I swear that dynamic filters are just not available for the f
[1322.98] Stephen: They don't mention it but no i'm pretty sure that dynamic filter support was simply never added for f1 because there's not enough
[1329.14] Stephen: Storage space and likely not enough resources because what you're running the gyro 1k or something
[1334.66] Stephen: It was like a laughable. No, it was a 2 was it 2k gyro and a 1k pit loop
[1339.62] Stephen: It was like really laughable and we can we can plug in and find out
[1344.34] Stephen: Looks like 54 CPU running a 1k pit loop. I think 1k was was seen as like super quick
[1353.06] Curry: Yeah
[1355.78] Jack: Yeah, like whoa calm down
[1358.9] Jack: You know 1k
[1361.54] Curry: Yeah, I remember with the f3s if you want a 1k loop that's sending pwm to the ESCs
[1367.14] Curry: Oh great
[1369.22] Jack: Sometimes when I open beta flight
[1372.18] Jack: Old-school
[1373.78] Jack: it uh
[1375.7] Jack: It's got a little twinge downstairs
[1379.94] Jack: Well, that's one way of putting it
[1382.5] Jack: my uh pc
[1384.98] Jack: Decides to shut off the windows
[1387.7] Stephen: And dlc wants to know if there's any way to obtain a blackout
[1392.5] Stephen: We get my triage frame
[1394.82] Jack: I tried but this this guy wanted like
[1398.5] Jack: A hundred pound for it or something ridiculous
[1401.94] Curry: So cheaper than it was when it came out because that's
[1405.06] Curry: What what got me into the first sort of mini quads?
[1409.14] Curry: was
[1410.18] Curry: uh
[1411.06] Curry: Me and my friend looking at this thing saying we can't afford that and he started
[1415.22] Curry: 3d printing them as a reasonable copy
[1418.26] Curry: And uh he for a little while he had a little business
[1421.94] Curry: Printing out these frames and selling kits they worked all right
[1425.06] Curry: It was only when the likes of the zmr 250 came along that that was no longer a thing
[1429.7] Curry: Well, we got them. What's going on? Look at them
[1432.82] Stephen: There you go for our audio listeners jack has opened an exceptionally old copy of beta flight
[1438.82] Jack: Yep, look at that
[1441.62] Stephen: What is there are not nearly enough tabs that vary your ports notice that there are two whole ports
[1449.22] Stephen: Because
[1451.62] Stephen: Luxury you
[1452.98] Stephen: Pulls to the lock on thick one. You're running not only an accelerometer, but also a freaking 2k gyro. Wow
[1460.74] Curry: Yeah, hot stuff. This is quick. He's got one shot one two, five again one shot one two, five when that came out
[1466.18] Curry: This is like
[1467.46] Jack: This is amazing. This is like so much better. It's one up from pwm
[1474.26] Jack: Shut your face. Look one big
[1477.22] Jack: You got pwm one shot one shot
[1481.38] Curry: From pwm, but it was still like you can send a like a ese signal so much more often
[1488.66] Curry: And thus everything flies better. It's it's pretty much what was needed to fly
[1492.98] Curry: Mini quads properly because until that time if you're on pwm
[1496.9] Curry: It was kind of like you're on
[1498.9] Curry: Big ass quads could could just about fly pwm. Everything else looked horrible
[1503.78] Stephen: So
[1504.9] Stephen: 125 refer to the the signal time for a single signal or is it the number of updates per second or what i've got no idea you're going to have to
[1516.58] Stephen: Go no, there's one shot 42 as well, but that didn't seem to work on jack's quads
[1520.58] Stephen: So i'm presuming 125 is the slower one and 42 is the faster one
[1525.46] Stephen: It's also got air mode, hasn't it if you scroll down?
[1528.74] Stephen: Yeah
[1531.38] Stephen: Oh my god
[1533.38] Stephen: This is this is what person says. I can't read your screen
[1536.02] Stephen: It's too small controller doesn't know there's an osd the osd is is snuck in in the side
[1543.46] Jack: Yeah, I might have broke the osd by plugging in usb at the same time. Oh dear three two five
[1551.3] Stephen: B to fly and configurator 10 two or ten three, I think one of the two
[1556.1] Curry: Lots of people still like the version three
[1559.7] Curry: Something was it was it three point
[1564.82] Stephen: Lots of people is going out in a limb really at this point
[1569.06] Stephen: People who don't want to update like it because they had it working like three years ago
[1573.3] Stephen: But from three five to four three, there is an absolute mountain of changes
[1579.14] Stephen: You have no rpm filtering. You don't really have an optimized dynamic notch on three five
[1584.58] Stephen: Everything is just that the filtering is much faster and much better on newer builds
[1590.58] Stephen: So I have a certain sort of
[1592.18] Stephen: Super skepticism when people say they fly the older stuff because it probably means they just fly the defaults and they didn't get around to tuning it
[1598.9] Jack: Three point five point center for the wing
[1602.26] Stephen: Oh, yeah, that's the latest one
[1604.42] Stephen: latest of three five, yeah
[1607.06] Stephen: If you've got an f3, that's that's what you're on unless you're running joe lucid's like carved up for zero build where
[1613.54] Stephen: You can get rpm filter on f3, but you have to kind of
[1617.62] Stephen: Some if you want to run rpm filter and other stuff
[1619.86] Stephen: you might end up having to overclock your f3 and then you have to like put in all sorts of hacks because if you
[1625.28] Stephen: Overclock it and plug in usb. It stops the usb working. So you've got to make it overclock only
[1631.94] Stephen: When uh usb isn't attached
[1634.42] Jack: Yeah, and the rc is welcome any time to come back
[1639.7] Jack: But are you waiting that at fail safe? Sorry. Yeah fail safe. Yeah
[1643.94] Jack: It's yeah, you flash it back
[1647.3] Jack: flash it to
[1648.98] Jack: this is the um
[1652.1] Jack: Express and the rest diy module that fail safe
[1656.42] Jack: uh provided me
[1658.26] Jack: but um
[1659.78] Jack: Yeah, I I flash it back
[1662.42] Jack: a few steps
[1664.26] Jack: Down to two eight or something
[1666.82] Jack: and then the
[1668.26] Jack: Symbol the little logo for express lrs appears on the screen
[1673.46] Jack: and
[1674.42] Jack: That's it. But yeah, the
[1676.74] Jack: The screen no longer displays anything on three dot
[1680.42] Jack: o
[1681.7] Stephen: Dot one
[1682.9] Stephen: Did you ask on their discord and say yo, what's up?
[1687.22] Jack: And uh, I updated this to edgy tx and there's no luis script for
[1693.3] Jack: Uh
[1694.98] Jack: Crossfire weirdly enough. I don't know where the hell to get out
[1698.74] Stephen: The lower script should still work, right?
[1701.3] Stephen: Yeah, it's the same thing crossfire crossfire hasn't changed
[1705.94] Stephen: Should be the same lower
[1708.18] Stephen: If you use edgy tx buddy
[1710.58] Stephen: There's a section that builds out your sd card and it should upload the default luis script. So I think it definitely does this
[1716.74] Stephen: That's what I did
[1719.22] Jack: I thought I did
[1721.54] Stephen: Yeah, so the lure relates to the version of your module
[1724.18] Stephen: It doesn't matter what version of edgy tx or open tx there
[1727.86] Stephen: The lure implementation is the same on the tails. I can't win lot of love for three five seven going on
[1734.42] Curry: Doesn't need science or maths
[1737.62] Curry: or news
[1739.06] Curry: Well, I would still contend it if if you're flying this on a quad and everything is spot on
[1745.54] Curry: Then why would you bother up later? If ain't broke don't try to fix it
[1748.9] Curry: But if you like experimenting or there's a feature that you would like but is on a later version
[1753.86] Stephen: That's that's the reason to update think if you're on a five inch or you're on a really kind of basic loop
[1760.26] Stephen: It's probably good
[1760.98] Stephen: But there were lots of stuff in between those that just flew like pants on three five
[1766.26] Stephen: And flew a lot better once you got to like four two and four three
[1770.26] Stephen: Four zero was a problematic release that didn't help that they kind of implemented a bunch of new features, but the features weren't
[1777.7] Stephen: Totally smooth and ready for consumer use. They were a little bit rough and ready
[1782.82] Stephen: They kind of settled down in four one and then four two bit better and four three is honestly like just
[1788.98] Stephen: Idiot mode really you can
[1791.14] Stephen: You've got presets you like connect to the configurator and say oh, yeah, i've got crossfire. There's a crossfire preset. Oh, yeah
[1797.3] Stephen: I've got like a
[1799.62] Stephen: Immersion i'll see something video transmitter. There's a preset for that and blah blah blah
[1805.14] Curry: As we were saying the other day, I think I think it could still be improved stuff like
[1809.7] Curry: Uh, we were talking about
[1811.22] Curry: Uh vtx tables weren't we in like why why doesn't the protocol saying hello? You're a vtx. What can you do?
[1818.58] Curry: And sort of it tells it and it populates the table so you don't get
[1823.06] Curry: Cockups in the table and getting things stuck in pit mode
[1827.22] Curry: Because uh, it thinks you're running
[1830.18] Curry: Beat if like uh smart audio 2 instead of 2.1 stuff like that
[1834.1] Curry: Let's have to a couple of people
[1835.94] Curry: She's getting stuck in pit mode because they're on the wrong wrong setting
[1838.98] Curry: So we're putting the wrong things in the tables those rush tiny tank things
[1842.74] Stephen: They always want it to just be on pit mode for some reason
[1846.02] Stephen: It's like some setting if you left them unplugged for too long
[1849.38] Stephen: They just went back to the la la la I can't hear you i'm in race mode for some reason
[1855.3] Curry: Yeah, I I speak from
[1858.02] Curry: My own experience getting stuck there
[1860.82] Curry: And that's kind of because rush fbv can't quite work out what version of smart audio. They should be using they're saying it's 2.1
[1867.38] Curry: and
[1868.26] Curry: Beat if like saying it's two so you go putting the dbm values in it's like, I don't know what this is
[1872.82] Curry: I'm going to pit mode
[1875.38] Curry: When all you need is one two three four
[1878.42] Curry: Yeah too much like hard work
[1880.66] Curry: yeah, but um
[1882.74] Curry: I really haven't played before pretty much and I do find
[1885.94] Curry: It it's kind of feature overload and I don't understand the preset stuff when I looked at it because it's like here's a preset
[1892.66] Curry: This is an official one. This is from some man who you don't know
[1896.34] Curry: But he says he's he's using the same stuff as you you should try this. It's like, I don't know
[1901.62] Stephen: presets are trying to solve the problem of you'd like watch someone's video and they tell you a bunch of stuff to bang into
[1907.38] Stephen: the cli and you'd have to like
[1909.7] Stephen: Download a document or a google drive thing or copy it off the screen. They solve that problem of like
[1915.22] Stephen: Here's the the five commands you need to type it in a row instead of trying to
[1920.18] Stephen: Get them from somewhere and paste them in it just provides a bank of curated ones that people have sanity checked
[1925.94] Curry: I think so, but it's kind of like in the olden days whenever somebody used to see a video and it used to be good
[1931.06] Curry: You'd like to see all these comments saying what your pits?
[1933.94] Curry: And it's kind of like, you know, these are my pits on this quad on all this equipment for me
[1939.22] Curry: You can put it on your quad
[1940.98] Curry: but then you might just crash it into the ground or it might not work so well for you it might shake around like a
[1946.02] Curry: an old uh in jittery grandma, but
[1949.38] Curry: Uh, yeah, I don't know. I I haven't I haven't looked properly at be to fly i'm i'm very much
[1954.9] Curry: Uh the person you hate steve and i'm like i've put it on defaults. It seems to fly. Okay
[1960.5] Curry: I'm not looking any further than that because everything confuses me now. I don't understand what all the filters do
[1966.9] Curry: I I understand rates and I understand the basis of like the the pits and that's about it
[1972.18] Curry: But it was like you you just don't mess with the basics anymore. It's like sliders presets
[1978.1] Curry: Uh filtering
[1979.86] Curry: It's too confusing
[1981.94] Stephen: Yeah, the presets are there for all the rates and all the filtering and stuff
[1985.38] Stephen: So i'm gonna fly with like super flies presets or crunk presets and you want to fly with furruks rates
[1992.1] Stephen: Then you can just click and beep beep beep
[1994.5] Jack: It is weird. I I I really did struggle with it because like I was
[1999.54] Jack: You know, there was all these like videos that you would tune in
[2004.42] Jack: to um
[2006.42] Jack: Bardwell, and he'd be
[2008.82] Jack: Be like turn this filter on turn this filter
[2012.66] Jack: After the motors get hot and i'm like
[2015.86] Jack: I don't even know where to find those filters
[2020.02] Jack: You know, it's like type in this cli come on that's not documented anywhere
[2024.9] Jack: She's like, oh god. No screw that. Yeah. Yeah, it was just like i'm i'm out i'm out
[2032.66] Jack: I don't want to know
[2034.42] Jack: Yeah, and that's why you went to kiss the state that yeah
[2037.7] Jack: Yeah, basically because it just
[2040.58] Jack: Got too complicated
[2043.86] Stephen: I guess i'm just mathsy enough that I kind of get that stuff and for me it just clicks
[2049.94] Stephen: Just the way my little brain works
[2052.02] Frank: This episode was recorded in front of a live online audience downloaded and edited to make sense when it played audio only
[2058.74] Frank: Censored to please the itunes people hosted on the internet forwarded through to your podcast provider
[2063.52] Frank: Downloaded playing on your device and is now playing in your ears all thanks to our patreons
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[2072.74] Frank: Find out more at patreon.com
[2075.78] Jack: Let's drone out
[2077.62] Jack: How's um, uh, swanee? How's your transmitting stuff? Is it all good?
[2082.82] Jack: We've got uh, we we've got someone who could be on express lrs
[2087.54] Jack: But it scares them
[2090.66] Jack: Scares them about it
[2092.34] Jack: Don't know. I think it's just like way too complicated from the psychopaths that are in the community. Obviously
[2098.18] Jack: Yeah, it's easy. Like once you got it set up and you tell it your wi-fi password. It's lovely
[2104.34] Jack: But it's getting it to that point
[2108.58] Curry: That the head banging against the table. I see I never put
[2112.02] Curry: Ers on my own network. I just joined to
[2114.58] Curry: Ers. Well, I need to
[2116.34] Jack: Yeah, it's own network and then yeah, you know
[2119.78] Curry: You can you can have it just join to your network and do it different way
[2123.54] Jack: There are options and you're just like yeah like the the home
[2128.66] Jack: one dot
[2130.42] Jack: One 10.0.0.1. Yeah, that's it
[2136.02] Curry: Yep, correct it. Speaking of ERS. I've got the most ginormous
[2141.54] Curry: Module that i'm testing. Hopefully tomorrow. There's the beach
[2145.54] Curry: This is the the radio master ranger and it's got lights and stuff
[2151.86] Jack: Watch these lights you're ready for this
[2157.38] Curry: Look it's got skylights and different ned strips and it's got buttons and you can assign shortcuts to the buttons
[2164.9] Curry: And things which is new different
[2169.69] Jack: Yeah, fail safe. I'd like my my oled to work
[2176.09] Stephen: All I can say is wrong color fail
[2182.26] Jack: Oh, yeah, this is you on your cape stand obsessed in yellow
[2187.14] Jack: Someone's got a light. Yeah
[2190.44] Jack: I like the yellow oled. It's massive
[2193.72] Curry: I don't like the fact that the spin is a bit wonky. It's not consistent. It needs to spin
[2198.28] Stephen: It's quite hard holding your your phone with one hand and spinning a cake stand for the other one
[2203.56] Curry: Surely you would have like put some motor and gearing in there and said, you know what i'm going to resolve this problem of this
[2211.64] Curry: Thinking just like something in there and just like nice and smooth
[2215.4] Stephen: But yeah, it does look like an awesome transmitter and it's uh, it's got a metal case and everything, hasn't it?
[2221.0] Curry: Bit of a beefcake
[2222.6] Curry: Yeah
[2223.88] Curry: Is it is it is a giant?
[2226.6] Stephen: Will you be enabling the two watt mode to keep your hands warm in winter?
[2230.68] Curry: Technically, it hasn't got it hasn't got two watt mode
[2234.12] Curry: Unless somebody else changes the code is is what I believe you can go to the web
[2238.36] Stephen: You are capable of doing it bang up the max power to
[2242.5] Stephen: 2000 milliwatt and change the last character on the power line from a zero to a two and save it
[2249.56] Curry: I mean don't remember this bs
[2252.52] Curry: You don't need to go after over a hundred milliwatts. I'm going to test it out on right on one watt
[2258.6] Curry: Just just for fun just to see what the difference is it like unless you do all your freestyle around cell towers, of course
[2265.48] Curry: Yeah, I mean
[2266.68] Curry: There is there is a potential reason to use high power and that's if like if you're in a really tricky
[2271.96] Curry: rf environment you're literally
[2274.12] Curry: There's an abandoned bt tower, but all its antennas are still on and you're flying this as a bando
[2280.68] Curry: Then whack it up to two watts and you'll have a good time
[2282.76] Stephen: I don't know if you get any video, but you want to fly the russian woodpecker, but it's live for example
[2288.68] Curry: That's sort of nice sort of thing
[2292.52] Curry: But yeah, hopefully fingers crossed
[2295.08] Curry: The the weather doesn't change tomorrow and I can
[2298.2] Curry: Go and test it out along with some other stuff
[2301.08] Stephen: It's a big gamble anytime. I think it's dry. I go out there and slip over on my ass. So
[2307.24] Stephen: I'm not flying for a while hence all the wood builds
[2311.4] Curry: Yeah, i've i've got my specific
[2314.34] Curry: Fpv outfit. I have I have boots. I have uh, my
[2320.28] Curry: My
[2321.32] Curry: name
[2322.84] Curry: Uh top all in sheet put down. So i've got some of the dry
[2327.56] Curry: Keep away from the cows if I can
[2330.68] Curry: And and the I know the caravan site there is closed at the moment. So I might be able to go in there
[2336.04] Curry: And uh, then the cows can't get me
[2338.6] Curry: This is this is all good stuff
[2340.6] Curry: That's that's the hope
[2342.68] Jack: Chair in the table. That's what you want
[2346.36] Curry: Chair and a table I did used to take a chair with me
[2349.8] Curry: But now I just sit on the floor on my on my special top all in which I bought from the pantry
[2354.92] Stephen: Stand up if it's wet surely
[2359.08] Curry: Yeah, it depends what i'm doing it's like
[2361.4] Curry: Um, sometimes i'm lazy and i'm out of puff from stomping through the field and being chased by cows
[2367.32] Curry: So i'm going to sit down
[2368.84] Curry: And it's like I can use the old the excuse of like, you know, I want to test the radio more sitting down
[2375.0] Curry: Because it's more difficult for the signal, but yeah, you could stand up
[2378.76] Stephen: If you felt that way i've got one of those little helipad things
[2381.72] Stephen: But the missus has appropriated the pegs that put it in the ground
[2385.16] Stephen: So it's kind of useless because you hover over it with a quad and it blows off
[2390.6] Curry: Um, what is she using the pegs for?
[2392.84] Stephen: To know they just disappeared into the garden and they haven't come back and have to have words
[2397.72] Stephen: Borrowing for all my stuff
[2400.92] Curry: Camping shopping and get some more pegs to bank out
[2405.4] Jack: Yeah, all right guys i'm going to disappear i'm gonna
[2409.24] Jack: Travel up I think
[2411.56] Curry: Good luck
[2413.0] Jack: Yeah, thank you. I need it. Yeah, luckily
[2416.04] Jack: Hopefully I won't make too much of an ass of myself
[2419.08] Curry: Is it isn't me or have you slightly straight into your hair for the occasion?
[2423.08] Stephen: I have I have done it mode. Yeah, you've got a party. We've got a parting haven't you?
[2428.68] Jack: Well some some say
[2431.32] Jack: It's very silky frizzy. Good luck. Very smooth. Thank you. No worries. Take care guys. Look after yourself
[2439.32] Jack: Bye
[2443.0] Jack: Almost hit end broadcast
[2448.36] Stephen: Muppets with jetpacks
[2451.75] Stephen: It's a nice topic
[2453.43] Stephen: Stupid people have yet to kill themselves
[2456.07] Stephen: Let me so are you starting out by looking?
[2459.99] Stephen: Ah, it's up to you. I started out by looking at the gravity and I was kind of impressed by what was going on with
[2467.99] Stephen: Guy, what's his face doing all of his flying and I thought that's very cool
[2472.39] Stephen: And then notice that there's there's this loon who appears to have unlimited funds and just buys as many edfs as they can
[2479.65] Stephen: Physically get their little mitts on
[2482.23] Stephen: and yeah
[2484.87] Curry: Yeah, that's it because he started off we we both found this at the same time and reported to each other
[2489.75] Curry: he started off with these huge edfs and these these are significant amounts of money and
[2497.51] Stephen: Yeah, and then you decide not to use them
[2499.99] Curry: Yeah, and every time he plugged it in
[2502.31] Curry: He's like, oh smoke's coming out. Stop it a sec. And then he didn't change anything
[2507.75] Curry: And then looks he sees the smoke now and then he would go back put it out of a fire extinguisher. Oh, that's bad
[2512.79] Curry: Let's try it again without changing anything
[2515.49] Curry: expecting a different outcome
[2519.35] Curry: So he had massive fires from the lipos
[2524.79] Curry: From the escs and these things, you know, these are serious serious
[2528.63] Stephen: Money, aren't they? So it's the props inside each of these edfs for our audio listeners
[2532.95] Stephen: You're probably looking at a sort of an eight or nine inch prop inside these edfs
[2538.39] Stephen: And and he's wired it up with some not too generous cable. So he's probably just simply
[2543.91] Stephen: Burning out his solder joints on that cable
[2547.03] Stephen: And yeah, just isn't really thinking about it
[2549.11] Stephen: So luckily he he decided to have the sort of sensible strategy of
[2553.91] Stephen: Going with lots of smaller jets instead of two giant ones
[2557.67] Curry: He did actually get to the point where he was trying this out
[2560.95] Curry: And what he attempted to do is just rev up a bit and try jumping and then like would fall over because
[2569.99] Curry: It was literally just too much to try and hold on to so
[2573.67] Curry: He hurt himself. And yeah, then he eventually decided like
[2577.35] Curry: I think he actually properly damaged one of these things that he had like a fire
[2580.71] Curry: And some of the outer shell was damaged and some of the blades were damaged
[2584.07] Curry: The escs and batteries got buggered up. And so yeah, he bought a whole bunch
[2588.47] Curry: Of uh small edfs
[2590.87] Curry: Still still not what you call a small edf though, is it?
[2594.71] Curry: But he sort of figured he wouldn't blow up so much because he was disputing
[2599.11] Stephen: maybe a
[2600.47] Stephen: sort of four or five inch edf, but like
[2603.75] Stephen: Something like that
[2605.19] Curry: Oh, hang on. We're on the we're on the advertising section. There we go. Roll through all that bonbons
[2610.71] Stephen: yeah, so interesting very interesting, but
[2614.55] Stephen: Just that it's not a great deal of planning and here you were calling out his safety precautions
[2619.43] Stephen: Which were a bloke on the other end of this rope. Yeah, what's hilarious about this is that there was a bloke holding a rope
[2625.99] Curry: But there's no there's no pulley system and the bloke's not particularly strong and here's a guy with or heavy
[2633.19] Curry: yeah, so whenever
[2635.43] Curry: I was trying to watch it whenever he sort of loses balance
[2638.39] Curry: The guy on the rope just like well that hurt my hands and he just falls over anyway, essentially
[2643.35] Curry: So it's it's pretty useless
[2645.67] Curry: And he took a long time trying to work out his talk
[2649.03] Curry: And having a whole bunch of problems
[2651.27] Curry: And basically making it worse
[2653.35] Curry: He I mean he eventually got it so he could do what is essentially a a small flight if he if you go away to look
[2660.07] Stephen: Look at the edfs. He's got what like eight on each hand and a bank on his back that looks like a dozen of them
[2666.07] Stephen: Yeah, I think there's just 12 on the back
[2669.83] Stephen: Yeah
[2671.83] Stephen: Oh, he's he's got a symbol there like 20 edfs
[2676.63] Stephen: So it maybe he's heavily sponsored. Otherwise he spent like a couple of grand here on on edfs
[2682.15] Curry: Yeah, he said the original big eds were like 20 grand or something he spent on it
[2686.47] Curry: But he does he doesn't eventually get
[2689.35] Curry: To a point where he can hover
[2691.91] Curry: It's not it's not particularly steady and he's scared to do anything
[2696.79] Curry: too much with it, but it's uh
[2699.51] Curry: I suppose it's impressive that just the fact he didn't really have a 3d modeling
[2704.23] Curry: Much of a plan essentially
[2705.75] Stephen: He's got the 3d modeling down pat, but it seems everything like the engineering that isn't 3d modeling just
[2713.27] Stephen: Isn't really working out for him. He's able to draw things and make them look quite pretty but
[2719.35] Stephen: Yeah, I was surprised about with land speeder as well
[2722.47] Stephen: But it looks smart
[2724.07] Stephen: But actually the wiring and the safety precautions are kind of non-existent and they just rely on flying too high
[2730.71] Curry: so if you watch all the way through you would have seen a bit where
[2734.07] Curry: something goes wrong
[2736.39] Curry: And he's he's trying to get the edf off because it's just going full. There was no
[2742.39] Curry: Shut off switch
[2743.67] Curry: It's just like let's set it to half throttle and see what happens
[2747.11] Curry: Rather than having, you know something on the trigger that he could let go and a safety switch
[2751.03] Curry: So yeah, the safety thing's not really fought through that. Well
[2754.87] Curry: I think that's his problem, but he's still alive. He's still going. Yeah
[2759.11] Curry: and um
[2759.91] Stephen: I kind of think like quite jealous. He's got all this money, but it's just a shame
[2764.15] Stephen: He hasn't really planned on on using it sensibly. It's just kind of yeah
[2769.35] Stephen: Put my life on the line
[2771.19] Stephen: Build this thing but not really I mean they let him fly this in in public
[2777.43] Stephen: it's just
[2779.43] Curry: Yeah, I don't know if he necessarily asks and i'm not convinced he meant to do the spinny landing thing
[2785.11] Curry: He's slightly out of control descending
[2787.59] Curry: Really? I do like the mask though. That's quite cool
[2792.15] Curry: But yeah, I suppose we'll see what happens to it. Yeah, stephen you said you'd you
[2796.87] Curry: Been following this guy for a while. I haven't come across him till yeah
[2799.51] Stephen: He's been on my subscription feed for a while and he's done these kind of what people were terming hoverboards
[2805.43] Stephen: Where you just have a giant multi rotor and you try and stand in the middle of it and not lose a foot
[2810.95] Stephen: um, and he he was doing this as well evidently having access to quite the arsenal of
[2816.87] Stephen: of of motors and escs, you know the sort of things that x class pilots would
[2822.63] Stephen: Give an arm and a leg for and he just appears to have them sort of kicking around
[2827.43] Stephen: Which is interesting
[2829.99] Stephen: Yeah, there's some good footage here. I guess let me just
[2834.07] Stephen: Share this up and I and again, it's this sort of
[2837.59] Stephen: You see this the careful the careful testing here i've got a beam to hold on to I don't think he's actually
[2843.67] Stephen: He's not strapped onto the beam. He's just kind of like yeah, I can do a pull-up on this. It's going to be fine
[2848.07] Curry: I can't I can't see where there's there's a throttle
[2851.27] Curry: Like who's controlling who's controlling the power? Where's where's the where's the cutoff switch?
[2857.03] Stephen: Yeah
[2857.99] Stephen: Yeah, so an aluminum frame with a lot of quite large sort of x class motors probably running. Uh
[2864.95] Stephen: 10 13 inch props and um, yeah
[2868.63] Stephen: Great results because it's lifted off the ground, but he's having to hold on to a beam to save his life
[2876.97] Stephen: Which doesn't exact that's not really what you want tethered would be good, but
[2881.53] Stephen: You can't fly anywhere if you're holding on to a beam
[2885.53] Curry: Perhaps you could detach the beam and take it with you
[2888.89] Stephen: Yeah, maybe I just have like instead of a guy that walks down the road with a flag
[2892.97] Stephen: You have a guy that just carries a beam down the road in front of you
[2896.73] Curry: exactly
[2898.81] Stephen: Yeah, that was a little bit further in in other videos
[2904.41] Stephen: But I wonder why people have stopped doing these I I do wonder whether
[2908.73] Stephen: Everyone involved has just come a little bit too close to losing their life and stop doing this stuff
[2914.33] Stephen: This looks for all the world like he's got a tyrannis there and he's just kind of
[2918.97] Stephen: Flying this thing
[2920.97] Curry: Flying it because he couldn't work out like oh really I want manual controls. It's like, oh, that's too much hassle
[2925.69] Curry: Let's just carry on with the radio control then
[2929.05] Curry: He's got a lead running into that thing. So it's not
[2932.33] Curry: Lord alone. I don't know. Maybe maybe it's just the fact that like people do it and then they're like
[2936.49] Curry: Well now what it's like there's there's nowhere to go from here because this isn't
[2940.49] Curry: It's not gonna be a commercial product. I'm not gonna fly it around the park
[2943.77] Curry: It's like i'm just gonna get my truck and take my message
[2947.69] Curry: Dangerous unlicensed flying vehicle to just have a play around
[2952.41] Stephen: Yeah, I think that speaks to the the fact that it's very easy to get six foot off the floor with some giant jets
[2958.41] Stephen: But it's really really really difficult to safely travel a kilometer at say 100 meters off the ground
[2966.33] Stephen: Exactly. I mean it's kind of like oh i'm gonna do that
[2969.93] Curry: It's kind of like the guy that built that co-actual helicopter
[2973.79] Curry: He's still very much in hover mode a couple of feet off the ground
[2977.63] Curry: And it's like well, you know, I don't blame him
[2979.79] Curry: But you know at some point you've got to get off the part haven't you will this thing fly properly?
[2985.39] Curry: Or are you just gonna forever hover it around your?
[2988.51] Curry: uh local park or whatever it is
[2992.27] Stephen: Getting in and out of ground effect must be
[2995.23] Stephen: Really tricky with these big vehicles as well because you go from
[2999.31] Stephen: To get to the predictable
[3000.99] Stephen: Aerodynamics you have to go through the really rough aerodynamics of being stuck in ground effects with
[3006.59] Stephen: getting lots of
[3007.95] Stephen: Air bouncing off all the uneven surfaces and not giving you a nice consistent thrust profile
[3013.95] Curry: Well, that's the thing and the guy with the helicopter
[3016.03] Curry: He's literally sitting in ground effect and he's he's moving around a lot and I feel
[3021.63] Curry: He'd have a better time because you know, we've all gone and sort of hovered things before
[3026.11] Curry: And that can be much more difficult than just literally flying forward
[3031.07] Stephen: 10 or the only time it's easy to be like a couple of feet off the ground is when
[3036.03] Stephen: You're ripping along with a lot of forward speed and you're not in dirty air
[3040.11] Stephen: But if you come to a halt and you try and hold that same height hover
[3043.87] Stephen: In dirty air you just get buffeted around a lot by your own deflected thrust
[3049.63] Curry: That's it
[3051.55] Stephen: The enthusiasm's great Andy, I think that that there's got no quibble with that. It's just
[3057.15] Stephen: kind of
[3058.19] Stephen: Gives the impression that everyone involved with this is kind of
[3062.83] Stephen: A bit amateurish
[3064.59] Stephen: Which is a shame
[3065.87] Stephen: So I think honestly think if some hobbyists people who've built big
[3070.11] Stephen: X-class quads or built even nine or ten inch stuff and who've got good flight profiles out of them
[3076.99] Stephen: Like I think it was numbskull who was building some giant quads recently if people like that were to apply the same engineering skills
[3083.47] Stephen: to something like this then
[3086.51] Stephen: You know, they may not really want to put their lives on the line
[3089.39] Stephen: But I think they do a much better job producing something that was flyable
[3093.39] Stephen: Whereas it seems there's some youtubers with with a lot of money
[3097.39] Stephen: Or maybe an occasional engineer who just thinks i'll go have a go and he did have great engineering skills
[3103.07] Stephen: But there was no prior experience from flying anything else that was being translated into that
[3110.84] Curry: well, I suppose you never know sometimes this sort of like
[3114.44] Curry: The the amateurism of it puts it on kind of its jeopardy and that's that's kind of what you need in exciting videos
[3121.0] Curry: Like will I succeed or will I die because if you just
[3124.2] Curry: Set out to build something and like i'm going to do this this and this sorted and then you build that's not exciting
[3129.4] Curry: We haven't got the jeopardy like will it work? Look it's on fire. Isn't that exciting? I'm still going to ride it
[3136.52] Stephen: Colin first is an example who manages like both jeopardy and like half decent engineering I feel so it can be done
[3144.12] Curry: Yeah, he doesn't make it look easy
[3146.6] Curry: but he's
[3148.2] Curry: I was going to say it's relatively safe, but he's not really I suppose he's
[3153.24] Curry: Isn't he yeah
[3155.4] Curry: Oh, yeah, but he's still doing like 70 miles an hour on crazy little things without like a helmet on and stuff like that
[3161.4] Stephen: Yeah, but with gas safe certification, mate
[3164.84] Curry: That's what matters
[3166.44] Curry: so
[3168.36] Curry: Moving on last week
[3170.36] Curry: Um, I showed you that video of that ornithopter with the incredible
[3174.68] Curry: Wings, which looked very much like a bird and I was so
[3178.44] Curry: Taken with this stuff. I was like, can I find myself?
[3182.12] Curry: someone is actually making these things
[3184.6] Curry: and
[3185.48] Curry: That will will sell me one or get me one because I thought this looks really interesting
[3190.36] Curry: I thought no one's I must find them fpv. I think that might be really interesting
[3195.32] Curry: And I there was this one called the go-go bird, which is this sort of very basic
[3199.96] Curry: um almost like
[3201.88] Curry: That dji funny motion controller thing and it literally just flaps wings and I was like that's not very exciting
[3207.64] Curry: But that was about 200 not bad. I went on to rc groups
[3211.96] Curry: And I found this one guy
[3214.04] Curry: That seemed to be making them and trying to sell them unlike
[3218.2] Curry: That one japanese guy that seems to be just making them and showing everybody
[3222.36] Curry: and i'll show you um
[3224.6] Curry: a quick video from this
[3227.0] Curry: Or perhaps two videos. So we've got
[3230.52] Curry: This one here
[3232.52] Curry: uh, and if we look at this
[3234.92] Curry: This is one of his birds and this is I think is he going to be the two or three meter version like an albatross?
[3241.32] Curry: Yeah, and I suppose you could nitpick and say the wings don't quite come down perhaps as far as a regular bird
[3247.8] Curry: But the articulation on the wing I thought that's really impressive. That's
[3252.28] Curry: That's very cool. And he's got like a proper company. He's called beater and he's made a range of these things
[3258.44] Curry: And there is this one and I I got in contact
[3262.52] Curry: Doing doing my normal thing and and basically trying trying to get his free products if I can do which
[3269.88] Curry: Doesn't necessarily happen. I would never expect it
[3271.72] Curry: But I was like, hey
[3272.52] Curry: I've got this youtube channel and if if you ever feel like reviewing stuff and want something then I can help you
[3278.76] Curry: and
[3280.12] Curry: He's like, oh, no. No, these these these cost me an awful lot to put together and there's all these research and
[3286.04] Curry: Design things and you know, we've got a factory to pay for on stuff and it's like, okay fair enough
[3289.48] Curry: Yeah, you're a small you're a small company. You're not one of the sort of big bang good people or anything. So it's like
[3295.32] Curry: Let me know how much they are
[3297.16] Curry: And I'll you know, I'll see what I can do because I've got patreon
[3299.72] Curry: Maybe they'll be interested in seeing what it is and stuff like that
[3303.24] Curry: And I was kind of expecting him to come back with like, you know, you know, this is like
[3307.72] Curry: 400 dollars 500 dollars. He did say he's got a smaller one, which I should also
[3313.16] Curry: Show you as well called. Um
[3315.32] Curry: And there was a a non
[3317.78] Curry: articulated wing version
[3319.48] Curry: Which at first glance I thought this doesn't sound very exciting because there we ask how much he's charging for that for the
[3325.96] Curry: I'm going to come to I'll show you what it looks like first. This is one called
[3330.44] Curry: The silver seagulls enhanced enhanced. There you go
[3334.2] Curry: And this is this has got his little autopilot system in there. Not articulated wing
[3338.36] Curry: It's got an autopilot and a seagull. He's got an autopilot and a seagull. Look i'm not touching the control
[3344.2] Curry: It's just flying around and I thought well that's not as exciting but that still looks a lot better than this other one
[3350.44] Curry: And so I said, oh, okay fair enough. Well, tell me what the prices are
[3355.08] Curry: And I have to say I was a little bit taken aback
[3359.4] Curry: Because this little silver seagull we're seeing here
[3363.7] Curry: 1099 dollars
[3366.28] Curry: He said as as a potential partner, he would give me 5 discount. It's like well
[3371.48] Curry: Gonna need it
[3373.0] Stephen: That other one I showed you not as an old seagull mate
[3376.52] Curry: Yeah
[3377.72] Curry: the other one I showed you um
[3380.04] Curry: The two meter one five times rtf
[3383.46] Curry: 2769
[3385.88] Curry: If you want autopilot and data service, it goes up to four thousand one hundred and forty nine
[3390.28] Stephen: And if you go for the three meter wingspan
[3395.0] Curry: Three meter wingspan top spec autopilot five thousand five hundred and thirty nine dollars
[3401.4] Curry: Hmm and I said to him
[3403.64] Curry: That's a little bit out of my price range. I was like just to set the scene
[3407.88] Curry: Because because he's like well, how much did you expect them to cost?
[3411.08] Curry: And I was like, well
[3412.68] Curry: let me tell you modelers, uh
[3415.32] Curry: They're quite price driven
[3417.08] Curry: And most people when they're looking for a new plane or a new quad
[3420.6] Curry: They're looking at two to three hundred dollars if they're digital perhaps a bit more
[3424.92] Curry: But two to three hundred dollars is is what you get with uh, you know
[3428.52] Curry: Recently quad you'd go at like five hundred dollars more higher spec
[3433.48] Curry: and he told me that
[3435.88] Curry: Just to send it fedex would be two to three hundred dollars. I was like
[3440.92] Curry: Okay
[3442.04] Curry: that's
[3443.08] Curry: That's insane
[3444.68] Curry: I I don't think
[3446.44] Curry: Anybody outside of the pure enthusiast market will take it
[3451.24] Stephen: I've got a plane from china plane included for a hundred quid
[3455.08] Stephen: I know
[3456.44] Stephen: The shipping I suppose they don't have the volume but no this is china
[3460.84] Curry: This is this is a chinese guy that definitely does recommend me
[3464.44] Stephen: If you say no one spends that amount on a plane or a quad, right?
[3468.28] Stephen: And there we have left out one crucial group of hobbyists curry
[3472.44] Stephen: One crucial group that I have been chatting to this week, which is heli pilots and apparently heli pilots
[3479.32] Stephen: will spend
[3480.6] Stephen: three grand on a machine
[3483.24] Stephen: that
[3484.2] Stephen: Breaks and eats itself as soon as it touches the ground with a slight bump
[3489.24] Curry: So you make a good point here. So we're talking about the sort of 700 800 size
[3494.84] Curry: Yeah helis
[3496.68] Stephen: Big 700 size maybe three grand a pop
[3500.28] Stephen: fully loaded
[3501.4] Curry: So three grand does does it cost two to three hundred dollars in shipping?
[3506.52] Stephen: I don't know never tried to ship one
[3508.68] Stephen: There's a lot of metal in it though
[3510.84] Curry: so the sad conclusion of this tale before we segue into helis again is
[3516.6] Curry: I'm
[3517.48] Curry: Not able to get one of these because I can't afford it and we've chatted back and forth about
[3521.8] Curry: economics
[3523.88] Curry: Even if he did I feel the um, the shipping might be more expensive
[3527.96] Curry: Once once I get through all my other projects, I'm going to look at building it myself
[3532.52] Curry: Because that's how stubborn I am. I was like I can't pay for that
[3535.0] Curry: But I will I print it and make try and make it myself
[3539.24] Curry: because
[3540.44] Curry: With with all due respect to james buntin who is a really good engineer
[3545.88] Curry: And try to do an ornithopter
[3548.12] Curry: He's really good at robots and stuff, but i've never seen him fly anything else
[3551.48] Curry: So maybe i'm coming with a slightly more expertise in flying even
[3556.04] Curry: If i'm like a caveman when it comes to knocking stuff together, that's something
[3560.28] Stephen: I saw his ornithopter. It did remind me of the pigeon having a seizure
[3565.08] Curry: Yeah, I I feel describe its elegant flight. I feel there's stuff you can do there. I feel
[3571.16] Curry: If you had some sort of sensors
[3573.88] Curry: So you know where each wing is
[3576.12] Curry: That you can do a bit more with it and you could you could certainly do some joints in there
[3580.36] Curry: Because whenever you're just doing this flapping, it's a little bit. It seems a little bit out of control
[3584.44] Stephen: There's there seems more to do exactly but you need independent wings so that each you can control the roll with the wings
[3591.24] Stephen: That's what you need. Yeah
[3594.2] Curry: And it seems
[3595.88] Curry: It seems not too hard
[3598.04] Curry: To change the up flap and the down flap because they just literally do this
[3602.68] Curry: Whereas it it seems quite easy to to joint the wings. So when they come up like when a bird strikes upwards
[3608.76] Curry: He he's not old keeping his wings flat. He keeps them in so he doesn't
[3613.0] Curry: Resist all that wind and spoil his list lift
[3616.84] Stephen: And they also the the up stroke and down stroke are not the same amount of time
[3620.52] Stephen: there's like quick up stroke and like when you're swimming a kind of slow push down and then quick up and
[3626.52] Stephen: Whereas I think a lot of them are just kind of
[3629.24] Stephen: Just like that
[3630.68] Stephen: Yeah, exactly. Really sophisticated in terms of the motion
[3634.68] Curry: It'll be interesting. You had a good you had a good segue here into helicopters because I know you were talking about rotor flight a little bit
[3640.52] Stephen: I was fascinated by this despite the fact that i've never really flown a heli other than one which I think I
[3646.28] Stephen: Won at a conference which is ir controlled and absolutely bobbins. Basically the christmas cracker toy version of helicopters
[3654.2] Stephen: um, I was fascinated that a group had taken beta flight
[3659.16] Stephen: And they turned it into rotor flight
[3662.84] Stephen: By rewriting the pit controller and having all this tail assist stuff that would enable the tail to do your your
[3670.6] Stephen: I thought that was pretty awesome
[3672.44] Stephen: And someone popped up in chat and said I want to run osd. How do I do that? And I said
[3678.2] Stephen: What what what? Oh, yeah, we're in beta flight forums. You you run osd by enabling the osd and they said no, no, no, no
[3685.16] Stephen: I'm running rotor flight and I want to enable osd. I need msp osd for my walk snail enabled
[3693.22] Stephen: helicopter
[3694.6] Stephen: and this was
[3696.6] Stephen: Caught me on the back foot and I thought well that's
[3699.96] Stephen: That is unusual. Yeah, that's not something you hear about every day
[3703.48] Stephen: And I said, well, why can't you just enable a feature? And it's like well, I enable a feature
[3707.88] Stephen: It just doesn't turn on and then we found out they'd actually hardware disabled it and they've removed
[3713.4] Stephen: A whole load of the bits of code that used for osd and we kind of went back and forth and
[3718.76] Stephen: ended up
[3720.12] Stephen: Telling the guy which bits of code to change and he got a custom build that worked with his walk snail and stuff and
[3726.28] Stephen: I was just fascinated by it. He showed me some of his flight videos without the osd and
[3731.62] Stephen: Surprisingly smooth for heli i'd seen heli
[3734.92] Stephen: Videos before where it honestly looked like someone attached the camera to a hammer drill and was waving it around
[3741.56] Stephen: And this thing was it's pretty good. It was surprisingly good
[3746.92] Stephen: So, yeah kind of got in touch with dr rudder
[3751.72] Stephen: Probably not his real name
[3754.68] Stephen: And and just had a bit of a natter about it and it's a fascinating little project
[3758.68] Stephen: they've taken beta flight four two and just put a whole bunch of heli stuff and they've got a special heli configurator and
[3765.64] Stephen: Apparently it it is the only open source heli flight control firmware because most of the heli stuff due to its kind of
[3774.68] Stephen: lack of
[3776.28] Stephen: availability and lack of competition is all closed source and costs an arm and a leg and uh
[3781.56] Stephen: Yeah, it's just fascinating to find out about this stuff
[3784.52] Stephen: It seems cheap and you you can take some little whoop aios and put them in smaller helis and bigger helis
[3790.52] Stephen: You can put like f7 flight controllers and you build heli 32 escs and all that. It's um, just an interesting project
[3800.12] Curry: Yeah, sounds it I quite like the idea of gps hold as well if they get around to that when i'm
[3804.84] Curry: I I kind of need the panic button to say uh, oh it's gone wrong click
[3809.0] Stephen: Yeah, fortunately i'm out of trouble gps and barrow hold as well because barometer is a lot more specific
[3815.56] Stephen: It drifts a little bit over time, but you want to like lock in a height with a heli and the barometer holds will just
[3821.64] Stephen: Lock it in there. So yeah, very interesting little project
[3825.24] Curry: Interesting. Yeah, someone recommended it to me while I was starting out with the little heli i've got and I said
[3831.0] Curry: That's possibly a little bit too small for me to fiddle around with
[3834.6] Curry: And get that sorted in there, but um
[3837.24] Curry: Yeah, it's certainly interesting. It's interesting as well because although we think is like, you know, fpv quads is quite a large community
[3843.48] Curry: If you think about the sort of traditional
[3845.64] Curry: Modelers in the clubs running helis there must be probably more more guys doing that than that
[3851.16] Stephen: apparently much
[3852.68] Stephen: But well the guy on this project said that the quads are way more popular and he had hardly anyone had less than a hundred
[3858.44] Stephen: People using rotor flight and there are people who wanted to breathe new life into their old helis
[3863.4] Stephen: But essentially they've just got one and a bit maintainers for the whole project
[3868.12] Stephen: and it's hard to convince heli pilots that they should use this because they
[3872.2] Stephen: Just don't want to trust anything except the flight controller it came with because there's so much money in the air
[3878.44] Stephen: And so they're deliberately using older versions of beta flight because you know, they don't want any surprises
[3885.32] Stephen: It's a very interesting community when it's hard to test anything with a quad you test it. Oh, yeah
[3891.56] Stephen: Oh, it is trying to fly off on its own. Oh, never mind. Hang on
[3894.68] Stephen: Let me just disarm it and go and pick it up with a heli. You're like, yeah, that's it's a grand bin. It's just
[3901.0] Stephen: Spread over a field now
[3905.02] Stephen: Interesting completely opposite mindset
[3907.42] Curry: Yeah
[3908.86] Stephen: Anyway, we we patreon's up now. So we're out of time. We have we we've reached the end of the show
[3914.7] Curry: And uh, yeah, we we'd like to thank our patreons
[3917.02] Curry: thanks so much for helping us with the show all the the money goes into paying things like editors and
[3922.94] Curry: Fees to put stuff on spotify and hosting and stuff and it keeps us going. So we thank you all
[3928.22] Curry: and uh
[3929.82] Curry: Yes, as caroline says turbine model jets are multi thousand pounds too. Yeah, you're right. They're like
[3935.5] Curry: Can go 10 to 20 grand for a decent jet there. So that is more expensive than a model bird, but I kind of feel
[3944.06] Curry: That while a jet turbine has a jet turbine in it a flying bird still has a brushes motor
[3949.34] Curry: EOC and a couple of servos so an artisanal artisanal handmade flying bird. Yeah made in china
[3956.86] Curry: Yes
[3957.74] Curry: Anyway, we'll wrap it up there. Thanks to all of you guys
[3961.02] Curry: Uh, thanks for joining us and we'll be back to an amazing free people once again for next week
[3967.82] Curry: until that time
[3969.5] Curry: Say goodbye to steven. Goodbye. Have a good weekend
[3972.78] Curry: I've been carry kitten who's everyone's favorite even though they never show up for us
[3976.86] Curry: And we'll catch you next one. Thanks for joining us
[3979.58] UNKNOWN: Happy flying and we'll see you. Bye in the next video. Bye