=== Let's Drone Out — Episode 477 ===
Title: LDO 477 - MSGee Brain, what do you want to do tonight?
Recorded: 2024-10-17
Hosts: Koel "Koala" Anderson, Stephen "Belrik" Howell, Jack "Brightontillifly" Nash, Andrew "Frank" Hyams
Guest(s): (none recorded)
Total audience: 788
Platforms: YouTube (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2NR-1A2uiY); SoundCloud (http://www.podtrac.com/pts/redirect.mp3/feeds.soundcloud.com/stream/1937459243-letsdroneout-ldo-477-msgee-brain.mp3)
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[0.0] Jack: Hello, and you're listening to Let's Drone Out, a special thank you to our lovely patrons
[6.28] Jack: that help donate so that we can pay the editor to remove the swear words and silly things
[11.36] Jack: we say.
[13.0] Jack: Massive thank you to …
[14.0] Jack: Carlos Campos!
[15.0] Jack: Art Faulkner.
[16.0] Jack: Sam Dahmer.
[17.0] Frank: On with the show.
[18.0] Stephen: Hello, and welcome to Let's Drone Out.
[55.29] Stephen: Tonight you are joined by Jack, right until I fly.
[59.29] Stephen: Hello.
[60.29] Stephen: The Ton star, Tony.
[63.29] Stephen: Bonjour.
[64.29] Koel: Jack Starling Wife.
[65.29] Stephen: Yes, and of course Jack Starling Wife.
[67.69] Stephen: We shouldn't need to say it now because everyone knows it, but nonetheless it remains true.
[72.45] Stephen: And camera dude himself, Paul, at the bottom there.
[75.89] Stephen: Hello.
[76.89] Stephen: Howdy.
[77.89] Stephen: Howdy.
[78.89] Stephen: And myself, Steven.
[79.89] Stephen: Good evening, everyone.
[80.89] Stephen: Hello.
[81.89] Stephen: We're not at horror stories just yet, but oh, should use this time to remind everyone
[87.25] Stephen: that it's going to be a Halloween show.
[88.97] Stephen: So if anything's caught fire, disappeared, up a tree or up a cow, please let us know.
[94.77] Koel: Up a cow?
[95.77] Koel: That sounds …
[96.77] Stephen: Especially.
[97.77] Stephen: That's very Halloween worthy.
[101.17] Jack: My favourite, I think, was on the Flight Test podcast, and they were talking about like
[105.93] Jack: flying at some event or whatnot, and they were flying a plane, and they were all the
[113.57] Jack: same plane together, like a group of them, like a little spotter, and they flew, and
[121.17] Jack: they came, and then they done like a perfect landing, and it was the best landing they
[125.05] Jack: ever did.
[126.45] Jack: And then some other guy walks out to their plane, and they started looking at the wrong
[132.17] Jack: plane.
[133.81] Jack: And they had been flying someone else's plane, and they had no idea where their plane ended
[141.05] Jack: up.
[142.05] Jack: That is terrible.
[143.05] Jack: That is shocking.
[144.05] Jack: That's like tuning into someone else's FPV feed, and like flying their flight.
[152.65] Jack: Wow.
[153.65] Stephen: Yeah, there's a lot of people, like Horizon Hobbies, that myself, hundreds of the same
[159.85] Stephen: model, same paint job and everything.
[162.89] Jack: I've been out flying twice this week.
[165.81] Jack: Oh, wow.
[166.81] Jack: Yeah.
[167.81] Jack: Yes.
[168.81] Jack: What?
[169.81] Koel: I know.
[170.81] Koel: What is going on in the world?
[171.81] Koel: Jack flew twice in one week?
[173.61] Jack: I know.
[174.61] Jack: What?
[175.61] Jack: How many packs?
[176.61] Jack: Two on the first day, and three today.
[181.61] Jack: Wow.
[182.61] Koel: Wow.
[183.61] Koel: I thought you said you had six packs.
[184.61] Koel: That's the extended session.
[185.61] Koel: Yeah, I know.
[186.61] Jack: I thought you said you had six ready.
[187.61] Jack: Yeah.
[188.61] Jack: I sent one to a friend, and I've still got two fully charged, and if he's not too sheer,
[194.61] Jack: I'll try and go tomorrow.
[196.61] Stephen: Huh?
[197.61] Stephen: Nice.
[198.61] Stephen: You must have run out of battery on your laptop, because it's normally like half an hour of
[201.61] Stephen: laptop usage per pack blown, so.
[204.25] Stephen: Yeah.
[205.25] Koel: I literally yelled at Jack the other day, actually, when he went out and flew his two
[208.41] Koel: packs, because there were like some settings that he was going to change.
[212.21] Koel: Sorry for...
[213.21] Koel: I'm going to expose you, Jack.
[214.97] Koel: No, it's fine.
[216.17] Koel: There were settings that he could change via OSD with stick commands, and I'm like, no,
[220.57] Koel: Jack, you can do this.
[222.17] Koel: He's like, I'm just getting out the laptop.
[224.47] Koel: I'm like, it's only going to take 10 seconds.
[226.57] Koel: It's like, no, I'm quicker in the laptop, and I'm like, it takes longer just to open
[231.27] Koel: the backpack, bro.
[233.27] Koel: My life.
[235.27] Koel: It's okay.
[236.27] Koel: You know what?
[237.27] Koel: Like, you will do it one day.
[239.47] Koel: I will force you.
[240.47] Koel: Yeah.
[242.47] Stephen: Five menus deep, and you're trying to change things, and you're just like left, left, left,
[247.47] Stephen: left, up, up, up.
[249.47] Stephen: Yeah.
[250.47] Stephen: Some things are useful with stick commands, but some things drive me insane.
[254.47] Jack: Yeah.
[255.47] Jack: Yeah.
[256.47] Jack: And I'm yet to meet anyone who can use camera control through the OSD.
[262.47] Stephen: Can you do that, Cole?
[265.47] Stephen: No.
[266.47] Stephen: No.
[267.47] Stephen: Someone asked me about camera control, and I was like, yeah, I'll help you out, mate.
[270.47] Stephen: Yeah, let's do this.
[271.47] Stephen: And I started reading the how-to page on camera control, and it's like, for this type of camera,
[277.47] Stephen: we recommend soldering a 10 kilo ohm resistor.
[280.01] Stephen: For this type of camera, we recommend a 330 ohm resistor soldered between these two pins.
[284.47] Stephen: For this type of camera, I'm like, oh, sweet Jesus, no.
[288.47] Stephen: No.
[289.47] Stephen: Do not use camera control.
[291.47] Stephen: No.
[292.47] Stephen: Every single flight control is different as well, it seems.
[294.47] Koel: No.
[295.47] Koel: With camera control, this is what you do.
[298.47] Koel: You can, if you really want, on the back of your analog camera, you still have your little
[302.47] Koel: joystick thing connected to it.
[304.47] Koel: So if you really want to, you can hook it up.
[307.47] Koel: But for me, in the last, I would say what, two, three years, I guess two years, the only
[315.47] Koel: time I've used camera control, point blank period, whether it was just on the camera
[321.47] Koel: itself, was I got a new camera, I need to remove OSD elements.
[325.47] Koel: Yeah.
[326.47] Koel: So if you've gone in on the flight controller through the GUI or anything like that to
[329.47] Koel: go change stuff like that.
[330.47] Stephen: Or once in a blue moon, when you're flying at twilight and you're like, stop, don't tell
[335.47] Stephen: that black and white, just stay on black and white or something.
[338.47] Koel: Well, see, that's the thing.
[340.47] Koel: I have mine, mine are always on auto.
[343.47] Koel: And if I need to make some slight adjustments, I use my Fat Shark goggles, I turn up the
[347.47] Koel: brightness, change the contrast a little bit.
[350.47] Koel: That's it.
[351.47] Koel: I'd never touch it.
[352.47] Stephen: The thing that will get me is when it was in that awkward sort of hinterland between
[356.95] Stephen: enough light for color mode, and not enough, and it would kind of go from color and drop
[362.19] Stephen: into black and white mode.
[363.83] Stephen: And then you go just turn out the shadows and it will go always bright enough back to
[367.31] Stephen: color mode.
[368.55] Stephen: And that would be a bit jarring.
[369.87] Stephen: So sometimes I turn off auto, but that's like a once a year change.
[375.63] Koel: Well, see, I never do the auto black and white to color one, like I always just have it on
[382.39] Koel: color.
[384.63] Koel: And then I just use a cat cam and then you don't need black and white for low light because
[388.35] Koel: it can just see everything.
[389.63] Koel: So but that's kind of that was kind of my go to.
[395.23] Koel: But Jack, though, you were going to say something about Cole and I something and then you got
[400.79] Koel: cut off there at the beginning.
[404.83] Jack: I can't remember.
[407.71] Jack: I know.
[408.71] Jack: Yeah, me.
[409.71] Jack: Yeah, that's it.
[410.71] Jack: Me and Cole.
[411.71] Jack: Caroline Taylor is in the chat.
[414.47] Jack: Yes.
[415.47] Jack: And Tyler, sorry.
[421.47] Jack: And yeah, your camera settings and Clive's in there as well on the Discord group because
[430.95] Jack: we made Cole's special camera corner where you can ask all manner of camera related interests
[440.83] Jack: and questions.
[441.83] Koel: Well, you know what?
[442.83] Koel: So I was I actually so Caroline, I did see your I just as you wrote in the chat, I saw
[449.59] Koel: your video in the Discord and it does look like it's a little on the dark side and I'm
[455.47] Koel: not talking about Star Wars, but the color correction made it look good, although, yeah,
[462.79] Koel: I think on a day like that, you wouldn't really need any ND filter.
[467.39] Koel: So it looks like, yeah, it was definitely really underexposed.
[470.83] Koel: I'm wondering if you had your ISO locked at 100.
[476.75] Koel: If it was, that would be the ND plus the ISO at the at 100 would have been the culprit
[483.87] Koel: for it being this dark.
[486.35] Koel: The color correction actually seemed to be able to bring back quite a lot, which is very
[490.99] Koel: surprising.
[491.99] Koel: And it's still clean.
[492.99] Stephen: It doesn't look like grainy or anything about the exposure, aren't you normally someone
[496.87] Stephen: who says, you know, avoid the sky getting blown out and like make sure you've got enough
[500.95] Stephen: to capture contrast.
[504.47] Koel: What I usually say is like on a day like this, what I would actually do is just expose evenly
[513.75] Koel: if it was like I have everything sort of at zero on the exposure meter.
[518.39] Stephen: I live in this country, so I can tell you that sky should be like a light concrete color.
[524.03] Stephen: That's what it should look like for accurate portrayal of England.
[528.83] Koel: Yeah, I mean, the only other thing I would say, I don't think I have it at full resolution,
[533.87] Jack: which is a golf course.
[535.67] Jack: Did anyone else see the strange man stood in the clearing of trees?
[542.11] Jack: There's a guy walking a dog right there walking a dog, a euphemism or I don't know, I'm actually like
[552.27] Koel: I actually quite like the way that the image looks, even though it was so underexposed
[558.43] Koel: and you brought it back, it's very surprising.
[562.43] Koel: I would say ditch the ND filter on a day like this and maybe set a range of like one hundred
[569.67] Koel: to maybe four hundred at most with the ISO has recovered quite a bit, though.
[575.19] Stephen: I mean, yeah, they've got very lucky with the color correction or or there's something
[580.55] Stephen: to that because it seemed like the grass and everything came out, OK?
[584.99] Koel: Yeah, and I guess my what did I say for settings?
[587.91] Koel: I'm going to just scroll up here and said I said for.
[592.59] Koel: So for ISO for overcast day, I said, yeah, one hundred to max four hundred on the ISO,
[599.79] Koel: maybe eight hundred pushing it.
[603.51] Frank: Start bringing in noise, though, if you start pushing it up.
[608.19] Koel: Yeah, that's why I said, like, you know, four hundred max, eight hundred is kind of pushing it.
[611.95] Koel: But I think have you tried one of those little runker?
[618.07] Stephen: I think it's a run cam that she's got, isn't it?
[619.83] Stephen: One of the little L shaped things, little thumbs.
[622.11] Koel: Yeah, I haven't tried it.
[623.47] Koel: No, I've only ever tried the run cam five orange.
[628.78] Stephen: Because I guess you're not getting a great sensor in there.
[630.58] Stephen: It's nothing like a GoPro sensor, right?
[633.06] Koel: Yeah, I mean, honestly, I think like there's no really such thing
[637.94] Koel: as a bad sensor these days.
[639.94] Koel: It's just really cool.
[641.7] Stephen: It's the software, isn't it?
[643.3] Stephen: Yeah. Yeah.
[644.46] Stephen: Image processing on the camera.
[646.86] Koel: Yeah. So Caroline Tyler saying the worst thing about that camera is that you can't preview the video.
[653.1] Koel: Right. It definitely is a decent picture, though.
[655.3] Koel: Yeah. So Mike, I'm curious.
[658.26] Koel: So. Oh, you're right, because I'm going back to my run cam five orange days and it was like, OK,
[665.5] Koel: set up some settings on the on the on your phone, do a little QR code scan thing and like hope for the best.
[673.78] Koel: I had actually never used N.D. filters with the run cam five orange.
[680.46] Koel: But yeah, I would say going like next time you go out if it's a day like that, just ditch the N.D.
[686.06] Koel: And and should be better.
[691.1] Koel: Yeah. Audio Gex saying the their run cam five orange produced 110 megabit videos.
[697.78] Koel: Still not a GoPro. No, it's definitely not.
[700.22] Koel: But I don't know, man.
[702.18] Koel: I think that it's not all necessarily all about bit rate.
[707.38] Koel: It's like, yeah, bit rate is like a big thing.
[709.98] Koel: Like obviously, the more data, the better it's going to look.
[712.18] Koel: But I mean, you look at like an old, say like Canon Rebel camera, the bit rates on those are terrible.
[719.06] Koel: But you could still get some decent video out of it.
[721.86] Koel: So I do think it's kind of all in the it's all in the settings.
[727.62] Koel: It's really all in the settings.
[729.06] Koel: And like it's a never ending experiment, really.
[731.98] Koel: Like you kind of have to you got to find what works the best.
[735.3] Koel: And you don't always get that first try, which I've learned.
[739.1] Stephen: You're going to find that lucky coincidence where you're playing to the camera's strengths and doing what it does best.
[744.62] Stephen: Because there's a whole bunch of the sensors, one part.
[747.94] Stephen: But there's a lot of black box between the sensor and the memory card.
[752.46] Stephen: There's going to be some image processing stuff that you have on your mobile phone.
[756.78] Stephen: Like your mobile phone probably has a plastic lens and a sensor that is minute.
[762.74] Stephen: Yet you get some great photos because it just throws software at the problem.
[766.3] Stephen: And there's a huge variation in the level that cameras do that.
[770.86] Stephen: Something like a GoPro, a lot of their intellectual property that makes the GoPros great is that kind of image modeling and color science that they're they're altering that image in software.
[782.1] Stephen: Once it comes off the sensor, they're denoising it, they're pumping out the colors, they're applying all sorts of effects.
[788.3] Stephen: And that's often the difference between the expensive cameras and the cheap ones.
[792.98] Stephen: It's not necessarily you get a massive lens assembly and something that looks like a professional camera, like an SLR.
[799.94] Stephen: But that it's going on in software, right?
[803.02] Koel: Well, take a look at this.
[804.58] Koel: So this is literally from a phone.
[807.66] Koel: This is from an iPhone.
[809.14] Koel: And I actually compared like when I saw this clip, I didn't realize where it was from at first because I thought it was from like my actual Sony mirrorless.
[817.78] Koel: And then I was like, wait, no, this isn't.
[819.46] Koel: This is actually from just from my iPhone, like, yeah, dude, that's what I'm saying.
[826.98] Stephen: Any camera is the video clip for our audio listeners is a view out over the mountains.
[832.94] Stephen: And you're able to see with great clarity peaks, probably some 25, 30 miles kilometers away, a great amount of contrast in the clouds.
[842.9] Stephen: There's some kind of sunset level lighting that's really portrayed very well and perfect levels of contrast.
[848.94] Stephen: Everything remains visible.
[850.66] Koel: Yeah, the dynamic range is still even good.
[852.62] Koel: So it's like that's what I mean.
[855.62] Koel: Like that's when I sort of say like it's not necessarily the it's not really about the cameras or the sensors or anything these days because they're all capable.
[866.66] Koel: They're all fully capable.
[867.94] Koel: It's just getting the right settings that that's the one thing I would stress the most.
[873.58] Stephen: And you might find that what's actually coming off the sensor in that iPhone is a pretty grainy image and it's doing some edge detection.
[882.1] Stephen: And like, you know, removing the noise from noise and all sorts of tweaks.
[886.66] Stephen: And this has been seen in an extremist with Samsung phones, right, where people have taken pictures of the moon and they've, you know, they've got something that looks like like a penny with no detail on it at all.
[899.42] Stephen: Just a penny in a flashlight, basically.
[902.26] Stephen: And the Samsung will be like, well, based on what we see in like Wikipedia and online image libraries of maps of the moon and the time of day and the position on Earth,
[911.54] Stephen: where you are, it probably looks like this.
[913.46] Stephen: And it will just like put all the moon features that are totally invisible to the camera and just slap them onto the image for you.
[920.54] Koel: Yeah, that's wild. That's absolutely wild.
[923.82] Koel: Yeah. Yeah, that that's that is a very weird thing.
[929.14] Koel: I think I think a lot of people were miss.
[933.38] Koel: I think it misrepresented the camera quality in that when it first sort of came out that feature.
[938.38] Koel: People didn't realize, like, oh, this is actually kind of like is a the right word, maybe.
[944.42] Koel: Yeah, that's a lot of image process.
[946.5] Stephen: AI is maybe overplaying the hand a little bit, but it's definitely doing some like machine learning on it for sure.
[952.42] Jack: Yeah. Well, augmented reality.
[957.1] Stephen: Yeah. So it's finding finding something that it knows is the right answer and giving you the right answer.
[962.22] Stephen: But that wasn't actually what your phone saw at the time.
[965.82] Stephen: Yeah, it's akin to like pointing your phone at a sign in Chinese and seeing the answer in English.
[973.18] Koel: Yeah, computational photography. Absolutely. Thank you.
[976.38] Koel: Yeah, that's that's exactly what it is.
[979.54] Koel: Yeah, I mean, I would say, Caroline, next time, I think I've repeated myself a thousand times here,
[985.78] Koel: but just just ditch the N.D. on a cloudy day that you really like N.D. is just sunglasses for your camera, right?
[993.9] Koel: So if there's no sun, you probably don't need sunglasses.
[997.02] Koel: So that's kind of how I think of it.
[999.54] Stephen: Unless you're trying to deliberately slow the frame rate, I guess, right?
[1002.98] Koel: Yeah. More blur. Yeah.
[1004.42] Koel: If you want that slow shutter speed and whatnot. Yeah. But I'm very anti that about it all day.
[1013.94] Koel: Yeah, I honestly, I don't really care all that much.
[1019.38] Koel: Although I do find that if you if it's like a bright sunny day and you don't have N.D. filter and your shutter speed is really high,
[1026.62] Koel: sometimes you can actually get a jello effect and and wobbles and stuff,
[1032.66] Koel: because basically, I think it's more prone to picking up vibration because there's basically the window is opening and closing or,
[1042.54] Koel: well, you know, hypothetically more high frequency motion. Exactly.
[1047.26] Koel: Yeah. So that's that's the only honestly, that's actually the only reason I use N.D. filter on GoPros or cameras in general is just to avoid that stuttery or vibration sort of look.
[1058.34] Stephen: Yeah. But you can fly around it. You just need to like mind the throttle.
[1062.1] Stephen: If you're going to like stick bang all the time, then you are probably the kind of person that wants that.
[1067.22] Stephen: But if you can avoid like banging on the sticks quite so hard, you can probably fly around the vibration.
[1073.42] Koel: Yeah, yeah. Yeah, actually.
[1075.86] Koel: So I was actually looking back at footage from from Taiwan recently.
[1081.78] Koel: And there was actually let me see if I can find it because it might show better.
[1087.46] Koel: And I don't know if we're like trying to talk about this all this whole show or not, but I guess it's pretty relevant.
[1092.86] Stephen: Let's see. On a related note, I went to the cinema recently.
[1095.98] Stephen: And while I absolutely freaking love these new like 4K laser projectors, I saw Alien Romulus.
[1103.58] Stephen: An OK movie, high points, low points.
[1105.58] Stephen: But the thing that really got me was there was an amazing clarity of image when it came to detail.
[1110.78] Stephen: Yeah, you're still looking at like 24 frames a second.
[1114.06] Stephen: And yeah, a lot of the fights that the fight scenes and fast action things are very much looking at a slideshow.
[1120.86] Stephen: I was looking at like freeze frames of action.
[1123.94] Stephen: And I was painfully aware that I wasn't looking at motion.
[1127.26] Stephen: The motion was so fast and it was, you know, like shaky cam, sort of very fast camera moves.
[1133.14] Stephen: But you just see like freeze frame, freeze frame, freeze frame, because you're 24 frames a second is not that many frames when you're spinning the camera around like crazy and you're sat right in front of a 4K screen.
[1145.94] Koel: Yeah, see, the thing is, for me, I actually prefer 24 frames per second.
[1151.9] Koel: I audio get saying high shutter speed is only a problem when shooting at a low frame rate.
[1157.06] Koel: Maybe I don't know.
[1160.06] Koel: I know that it's definitely a problem at 24 and 30, which I guess would be considered lower frame rates.
[1167.66] Koel: And I am curious to see like on like a bright sunny day, if I say shot at 120 frames per second with a high shutter speed, if it would still give me vibrations and whatnot.
[1177.02] Stephen: I have to try that out, but I've got a bit of footage at summertime that I captured on the three when I was flying 120 frames a second because I wanted that in the goggles.
[1185.86] Stephen: And so that's just what you get.
[1188.54] Stephen: It was OK, but you definitely have to like baby the craft around a bit to make sure that you're not bringing out the worst.
[1195.62] Koel: Yeah, so so this video here, so this was actually a day when for some odd reason I made the choice to use ND8 opposed to ND16, which I pretty much always just default to ND16.
[1208.3] Koel: And there were certain times when I was going down this basically just kind of like doing like the little mini dive here down this little hill where I would notice a little bit of.
[1218.9] Koel: I'm going to find it, there was a bit of vibrational sort of like whatever happening and it's not all the time, it was only at like a certain clip, so I got to see if I can find it and it was only when I was going down the hill.
[1230.78] Stephen: It'd be really nice if you could isolate that with gyro flow, because that feels like something that gyro flow should be able to do at some point.
[1238.26] Koel: Yeah, let's see, OK, hold on, let me get up to the top of the hill so I can go back down the hill and find this.
[1245.26] Jack: It's crazy that that's crossfire and only 25 milliwatt, like it is mad what you can do.
[1255.86] Koel: Dude, I'm literally like I'm only I'm only if you see the water like straight down, I'm only on the other side of that water.
[1261.9] Koel: There's a little bank and then like I'm not far, dude, I'm probably like line of sight and line of sight in an environment where no one else is blasting the radio waves as well.
[1271.18] Koel: Dude, I'm probably less than like 200 meters away from myself.
[1275.14] Koel: But OK, let's see, I just want to find the wobble.
[1278.42] Koel: OK, I know it's coming up around here, but you only can really notice it in like the background.
[1283.9] Koel: Hold on. Where is it?
[1287.26] Jack: It's a one with pony and the roaches.
[1290.18] Koel: There was a little bit of it.
[1291.22] Koel: OK, if you look at the trees or the bushes that are coming up ahead of me,
[1295.34] Koel: get a line, you'll see like in a split second or right around now, you might get like
[1300.1] Stephen: there's like a slight, you know, especially we're looking at the the crunched version of this and it's not visible.
[1308.34] Stephen: It looks quite good.
[1309.62] Koel: Yeah, yeah, you're right.
[1311.54] Koel: And I always look at things with like a fine tooth comb.
[1315.1] Stephen: So like. Yeah, I mean, maybe if you're getting paid to like by a travel agency to produce something.
[1321.9] Stephen: Sure, you could nitpick, but like it's still a beautiful bit of footage just to take out with you.
[1327.82] Koel: Well, speaking of beautiful bit of footage, this part is not very beautiful.
[1330.82] Koel: This part actually sucked.
[1332.62] Koel: If you if you notice what happened to my DVR.
[1334.9] Koel: See, yeah, I think I probably show this to you guys before.
[1338.22] Koel: But yeah, yeah, I'm really lucky that I gave my friend that monitor to hold
[1342.74] Koel: because that was literally my my DVR on the right.
[1345.74] Koel: I couldn't see it, dude.
[1347.86] Koel: It was there was had to have been something wrong with my goggles, actually.
[1353.22] Stephen: And yeah, you're lucky you didn't fly into a tree like that was going pretty close.
[1357.38] Stephen: I kind of did a little bit of love tap.
[1361.3] Koel: I got really chickens chickens. Yeah.
[1364.9] Koel: But but actually, it's funny that we're talking about
[1368.98] Koel: those goggles in that issue at the moment right now, because
[1372.66] Koel: those exact goggles that I just had that problem where all of a sudden my screen went blank.
[1377.46] Koel: I am actually I was having this issue recently before I just traveled
[1380.82] Koel: the couple of weeks ago and I was getting noise in my goggles
[1386.3] Koel: that had nothing to do with a drone, had nothing to do with a receiver,
[1390.18] Koel: had nothing to do with anything.
[1392.1] Koel: So there was some weird noise being generated inside the goggles.
[1395.82] Koel: And it looks like Fat Shark just sent me an email.
[1399.42] Stephen: Were you bugged?
[1400.46] Stephen: Were you bugged by the dark forces that control our every movement?
[1403.98] Koel: Yep. Yeah.
[1405.22] Koel: And I have to say now, it says we're getting your order ready.
[1412.86] Koel: I don't know.
[1413.82] Koel: It says it's zero dollars.
[1415.1] Koel: It's a zero dollar order, but also you put it in for support.
[1419.06] Koel: Yeah, I did a support thing on it and.
[1422.3] Koel: I don't doesn't say what it is, but.
[1425.98] Stephen: Are they going to tell you what it was or are they just going to be like
[1428.62] Stephen: to the magic fix?
[1430.54] Koel: Well, no, you know what they said was basically, let me let me find
[1434.18] Koel: the email that I had with them, because you know what?
[1436.46] Koel: They were actually great.
[1437.38] Koel: And I was very surprised to even get an email back from Fat Shark
[1441.14] Koel: in this day and age, although I guess they're still around.
[1443.98] Koel: But it's just sitting there in his garage.
[1448.18] Stephen: He's probably not even dressed.
[1449.66] Stephen: He's just wearing like a bathrobe and slippers just hammering at the keyboard.
[1454.22] Koel: So it was actually I don't know if it was Greg who it was.
[1458.14] Koel: It was actually Patrick these days.
[1461.38] Koel: It was Patrick from Australia, New Zealand in the repairs department.
[1466.14] Koel: And he basically we were trying to do some troubleshooting.
[1469.58] Koel: And then believe it or not, out of nowhere,
[1473.66] Koel: Roto Riot popped up in the thread and said, hey, where are you located?
[1477.14] Koel: I can, you know, basically get you in touch with the right people.
[1481.22] Koel: And and, yeah, I think it was Jason from Roto Riot
[1486.26] Koel: ended up popping up and and they're helping me out.
[1489.34] Koel: So shout out to shout out to Fat Shark and shout out to Roto Riot.
[1493.9] Stephen: Believe it or not, keep the customers happy.
[1495.82] Stephen: It's good to hear the customer service carried on because that was something
[1498.54] Stephen: everyone always posted about that they had really strong customer service thing.
[1503.46] Stephen: Even Andy R.C. five, eight years ago was saying how good the customer service was.
[1509.06] Stephen: So good to see that carries on.
[1511.22] Koel: Absolutely. Although I am confused.
[1513.46] Koel: I am I am I'm wondering what
[1516.78] Koel: it says the item is the item name is strange.
[1520.62] Koel: I don't know what it says.
[1522.1] Koel: It says because I'm I'm using HDOs, which is the that's the goggles
[1527.74] Koel: that I was having an issue with.
[1529.58] Stephen: And are you going to get back something
[1531.62] Stephen: that is newer because they don't have any in stock?
[1535.74] Koel: Well, it's weird.
[1537.46] Koel: It says this is what the item says.
[1539.3] Koel: It says Dom V3 slash HD 2 comma 3 slash V6
[1544.74] Koel: RX HDMI FSV 3210.
[1550.02] Stephen: So maybe there's a common board that is in all of those models.
[1554.22] Stephen: Must be in yours, too.
[1555.54] Stephen: And it's busted.
[1557.42] Koel: Yeah, I bet you that's probably what it is.
[1561.9] Koel: I wonder if it'll pop up.
[1563.58] Stephen: Oh, yeah, to drone shots, 24 frames is all it takes to trick your eyes.
[1567.46] Stephen: I mean, I think that's that's what I was getting at.
[1569.34] Stephen: I think that's subjective.
[1570.54] Stephen: Like it's not 24 frames a second for everyone.
[1573.42] Stephen: And for me, 24 frames a second.
[1575.86] Stephen: If the camera is moving like left to right or it's moving around very fast
[1579.42] Stephen: and not just tracking something in a staple shot,
[1582.5] Stephen: it just looks like a series of static images to me.
[1585.1] Stephen: It no longer looks like motion.
[1587.38] Frank: That's the problem. Yeah.
[1589.54] Frank: This episode was recorded in front of a live online audience,
[1592.7] Frank: downloaded and edited to make sense when it played audio only sensors
[1596.82] Frank: to please the iTunes people hosted on the Internet, forwarded through
[1599.74] Frank: to your podcast provider, downloaded, playing on your device
[1602.82] Frank: and is now playing in your ears.
[1604.66] Frank: All thanks to our patrons.
[1606.86] Frank: Consider joining them and you'll also get other online benefits.
[1610.22] Frank: Find out more at Patreon dot com.
[1612.54] Frank: For slash let's drone out.
[1615.42] Koel: Sorry, and I don't mean to go back to the tour and go back to this thing,
[1618.5] Koel: but it says it's a Vin or TV.
[1623.78] Koel: Data transmission system.
[1626.46] Koel: Sorry, my new friend Greg.
[1629.42] Koel: Oh, it wasn't great.
[1630.98] Koel: I wasn't speaking with Greg.
[1632.22] Koel: It was sorry, Patrick and Jason.
[1635.86] Koel: I like you guys.
[1636.7] Koel: You guys are awesome.
[1638.14] Koel: And a lot for the win.
[1641.46] Stephen: Well, hopefully you can keep those in business for a while longer.
[1643.78] Stephen: They've traveled a long way, right?
[1645.02] Stephen: You've been to Taiwan with them a couple of times now.
[1648.3] Koel: UK, Mars on them, Canada.
[1651.06] Koel: Yeah, they are, man.
[1653.3] Koel: I actually I ended up buying because of this issue.
[1656.66] Koel: I kind of like didn't really trust those goggles anymore because they've been
[1660.02] Koel: like progressively something weird has been going on with them
[1662.42] Stephen: since that video, man.
[1664.46] Stephen: Like, yeah, everyone says this.
[1667.18] Stephen: Always take a spare.
[1668.62] Koel: Well, it's crazy.
[1669.82] Koel: Like a couple of days before I went on this recent trip,
[1673.06] Koel: I found someone locally selling
[1675.78] Koel: that shark HDOs with a rapid fire with true RC singularity
[1681.3] Koel: and a random I flight patch for like under 100 bucks.
[1686.06] Stephen: And I was like, wow, that's a steal.
[1688.38] Koel: Thank you. Thank you.
[1689.98] Stephen: Just the incentives in the module would be like 100 bucks.
[1692.9] Koel: I know. I know.
[1694.02] Koel: So I do have a backup now.
[1696.78] Koel: So then I guess I'll hopefully do this repair with the board
[1700.1] Koel: that fat shark sends me.
[1701.34] Koel: And yeah, then I have two pairs, apparently.
[1705.74] Koel: I'm just hoping that that's the case, although I feel like
[1709.98] Koel: they wouldn't have just randomly sent me that board
[1712.9] Koel: because they like without, you know, having some knowledge behind it,
[1715.94] Koel: like the issue I was having, maybe it's a known issue or something's going on.
[1721.82] Stephen: I don't know.
[1723.18] Stephen: It just sounds like wear and tear.
[1724.7] Stephen: And they've probably just been like, yeah, for, you know, inventory.
[1728.1] Stephen: Here's the board.
[1729.1] Stephen: This is the part we use so they could do their stock tracking.
[1732.02] Stephen: Yeah, I stole it for you. They should be back.
[1733.86] Stephen: I'm sure it'll be fine.
[1735.46] Stephen: If not, hey, you're on a podcast.
[1737.42] Stephen: You can tell us all about it and see what happens.
[1739.9] Stephen: Just a bookcase.
[1741.18] Koel: Yeah. Well, have you guys ever swapped a board inside your fat sharks before?
[1744.94] Stephen: Because I never have swapped a board inside my Skyzones.
[1747.62] Koel: Yeah. Is that how would my Skyzones apart?
[1750.42] Stephen: And it was inside because they've got these funky little
[1755.38] Stephen: VRX modules right in the Skyzones.
[1757.62] Stephen: They've got their own module in there.
[1759.54] Stephen: Yeah. And I kind of pried it apart and put on the updated module,
[1764.82] Stephen: which included an EOS backpack built into the module.
[1768.3] Stephen: So it wasn't fully like taking the optics apart or anything.
[1771.94] Stephen: You know, it was just like module disassembly.
[1775.22] Stephen: That was a little bit of a pain in the butt, but they'd done a nice job
[1777.82] Stephen: and it was like socketed with pins and stuff.
[1779.9] Stephen: So it was like a 20 minute job. Wasn't too bad.
[1782.86] Koel: Yeah. It's just weird because like I'm looking at the the actual part online
[1788.38] Koel: and I don't understand like.
[1794.9] Koel: I've never seen a U.S.
[1797.9] Koel: Am I crazy or have I not seen a USB on my
[1801.74] Koel: on my mini HDMI?
[1805.18] Jack: Yeah. Oh, oh, it's only pins.
[1806.94] Jack: It's HDMI in the podcast.
[1809.14] Koel: Oh, true. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[1811.06] Koel: Yeah. Huh.
[1812.14] Koel: So then what's the switch then?
[1813.98] Koel: And what's this input?
[1815.14] Stephen: This will be the external ports on your goggles, mate.
[1817.74] Stephen: There'll be a switch like that somewhere on your goggles. Right.
[1820.3] Stephen: Yeah. Oh, oh, oh, yes.
[1822.5] Koel: Oh, to change receiver on, receiver off. Yes.
[1826.14] Jack: Yes. Now we're to announce the headphone thing. Right.
[1829.5] Jack: Oxen. Yeah.
[1831.74] Jack: No. Oxen's on the side, I think.
[1834.22] Jack: That's headphones. Yeah, you're right.
[1836.5] Jack: Interesting.
[1838.46] Koel: OK, so basically I'm going to have to rip apart the whole goggles
[1840.9] Koel: and then take that off.
[1843.74] Koel: Well, I wonder if they are going to fit it for you,
[1845.78] Jack: because that's not the bit you've got the problem with.
[1848.3] Jack: You've got the problem with the driver board at the top.
[1852.98] Stephen: You reckon? Yeah.
[1853.66] Stephen: Well, why are they sending in that?
[1855.5] Stephen: And they should know what's busted.
[1856.74] Stephen: If they've if you send them in for repair,
[1858.66] Stephen: they wouldn't send in the wrong board and then be like, get out of here.
[1862.1] Koel: Well, the thing is, they're not sending.
[1863.98] Koel: I'm not sending it in for repair.
[1865.3] Koel: They're just sending me the board.
[1866.98] Koel: Oh, really? Oh, I thought you'd actually mailed it in.
[1871.7] Stephen: No, no. Spicy.
[1873.74] Stephen: OK, that'll be fun.
[1875.34] Stephen: Well, you can use the opportunity to like vacuum out all the fluff
[1878.5] Stephen: that's got in there for years and years of wear.
[1880.7] Stephen: You'll probably get like a small.
[1883.06] Stephen: He hasn't seen the fluff in his life.
[1886.94] Stephen: He'll open it up and there'll be something that looks like someone
[1889.3] Stephen: shaved a cat and left it inside his goggles.
[1891.58] Stephen: I'll just scream.
[1893.54] Jack: That's me.
[1895.54] Koel: So. Clive has swapped the so it is the HDMI board
[1900.26] Koel: then that I'll be swapping.
[1902.34] Stephen: It's easy to swap out.
[1903.5] Stephen: Just take care splitting the goggles on the cable
[1907.46] Stephen: splitting the goggles as the cables don't have a lot of slack.
[1910.98] Stephen: So when you pull the two plastic halves apart,
[1913.46] Stephen: you know, slow because you might yank a cable out
[1916.02] Stephen: and you're going to need to be very careful with those little cables inside.
[1919.98] Koel: I wonder, do I have to take out the screens to do this repair?
[1925.98] Stephen: Probably not. I need to know.
[1927.58] Stephen: No, this is all behind the screens that you got the screens and the optics
[1932.14] Stephen: that goes on to the face side and everything else is the other side
[1935.38] Stephen: behind the screens. OK.
[1937.54] Koel: Well, fingers crossed.
[1939.14] Koel: I mean, what do you think?
[1941.26] Koel: I should be able to handle this, AJ.
[1944.78] Koel: OK.
[1946.78] Koel: I did that. Jack is like my I always like go to Jack.
[1950.26] Koel: I'm like, Jack, am I capable of this?
[1952.98] Koel: Please tell me.
[1954.7] Koel: And he's like my what's the word?
[1957.62] Koel: I don't know.
[1959.18] Koel: I double check things with Jack because Jack is pretty good at.
[1962.82] Jack: I double double check things with you.
[1965.58] Stephen: Yeah, I just saw a picture of a Tesla sticker that someone's got.
[1970.26] Stephen: They've got a Tesla and the bumper sticker reads,
[1973.22] Stephen: bought it before we knew how awful he is.
[1978.06] Koel: Man, this morning I was driving.
[1981.7] Koel: There was a Tesla that was driving horribly.
[1985.7] Koel: I'm like, don't they drive themselves?
[1987.14] Koel: Like, what are you doing?
[1988.46] Koel: Like you own a Tesla, but you're not.
[1990.9] Stephen: No, it won't be for you, computer.
[1994.02] Koel: Yeah, I was actually really annoyed because they they tried to like
[1998.02] Koel: do a U-turn in the middle of like a road that was we were going like
[2002.26] Koel: there wasn't like a moment for them to do a U-turn.
[2004.14] Koel: They just decided to like.
[2006.3] Koel: I'm going to stop here and then I'm going to veer to the right.
[2009.06] Koel: And then I'm going to do my U-turn all while traffic is going.
[2012.34] Koel: I'm like, OK, you're a good driver.
[2015.18] Stephen: Yeah, yeah.
[2015.98] Stephen: I mean, that is like typical behavior for a taxi driver in London
[2019.26] Stephen: where they just like have complete hatred of everyone else on the road.
[2024.02] Koel: Oh, what is this?
[2025.7] Koel: Little.
[2028.46] Koel: Oh, look at that.
[2030.74] Koel: Like, what is it now?
[2032.74] Koel: I love the plus and minus cutouts, man.
[2035.1] Stephen: That's cool. Very neat.
[2037.18] Stephen: Adorable.
[2038.7] Stephen: I think I've got one like, is that a KM 60?
[2041.82] Jack: Uh, it is a.
[2044.7] Jack: Uh, do you know what it doesn't say?
[2048.86] Jack: I don't know what it is.
[2051.14] Jack: But yeah, it might be, but it's nice.
[2054.98] Jack: A tiny little one.
[2056.54] Stephen: I said, is it 20 by 20?
[2059.78] Stephen: Yeah, that might be there.
[2061.7] Jack: Sorry, it's either it's either kiss ultra or or be your flight.
[2067.58] Jack: And I don't know.
[2069.26] Stephen: I think they're both culture screwdrivers.
[2073.1] Jack: Yeah, I know.
[2074.3] Stephen: So how's the little quad building going, then?
[2076.3] Stephen: I can see there's evidently been some preparations made there.
[2079.26] Jack: Yeah, it's made.
[2080.94] Jack: It's going to be a slow process because I don't have a camera
[2085.78] Jack: and I don't have a mini tiny little VTX.
[2091.46] Jack: Like I, I had a robin
[2096.74] Jack: run cam robin, and I have not seen it.
[2100.86] Jack: I don't know where it is since it's into the move and the move back.
[2105.22] Jack: Like there's a lot of stuff that's kind of gone missing.
[2109.18] Jack: I'm looking to go back to PCV, but I have run camera robin.
[2114.62] Jack: I've never, never seen those.
[2117.26] Jack: Yeah, I have been this.
[2120.38] Jack: This ST link has been working over time.
[2126.78] Jack: Steven, you have created a monster.
[2130.3] Stephen: You found the slightly less less horrible way of doing it, though, right?
[2134.5] Stephen: That now means you can be a production line.
[2136.94] Stephen: Yes, it's flashing.
[2138.74] Stephen: Yes, like you revealed in a future episode
[2142.58] Stephen: where we were talking to the hard people at work, bringing you a 32
[2148.1] Jack: and I submitted a bug report and they fixed it.
[2151.62] Jack: And then I had to reflash everything again to a new bootloader.
[2156.02] Jack: It's been great.
[2159.02] Stephen: Yeah, I think they've now got like online bootloader upgrades
[2162.14] Stephen: like whole nine yards.
[2165.3] Jack: Yeah, it's it's crazy.
[2167.58] Jack: I mean, I've even flashed stuff that hasn't even been listed
[2172.74] Jack: with with with different boot loaders and
[2177.62] Jack: you know, not target specified.
[2182.38] Jack: Spicy ones, ones that just work.
[2185.14] Jack: Yeah, it's it's been a bit you can select a drop down
[2189.02] Stephen: for your your favorite tunes and things and all that doodle.
[2194.42] Koel: I was trying to find my STM loader, but all I could find was my FTDI adapter.
[2199.34] Stephen: Yeah. Oh, yeah, exactly.
[2201.26] Stephen: Suddenly different.
[2202.1] Stephen: That's like low voltage UART.
[2204.26] Stephen: Whereas, yeah.
[2206.9] Stephen: Yeah, the the ST link stuff, they're remarkably good value.
[2210.7] Stephen: They're like four quid.
[2212.86] Stephen: OK, they're off brand, but they all work and they work fine.
[2217.9] Jack: Yeah. I mean, I did have to update this.
[2220.78] Jack: It was like massive.
[2223.14] Jack: Oh, I'm drawing.
[2224.38] Jack: You made one of those CMSIS.
[2225.7] Stephen: Did you have the ST link?
[2228.46] Stephen: Did you convert the ST link into like CMSIS DAP and all that?
[2233.02] Jack: No, not yet.
[2235.3] Stephen: No, you just did did all all of them with the ST link.
[2239.26] Stephen: It was able to do like the archery tech and everything.
[2242.5] Stephen: Oh, that's awesome.
[2244.1] Stephen: So you used to need if you had like a different type of MCU
[2247.7] Stephen: that wasn't STM 32, you had to like hop around.
[2250.54] Stephen: And yeah, yeah, exactly.
[2252.22] Stephen: So same thing.
[2253.46] Stephen: Same little funky off brand ST link adapters.
[2256.26] Stephen: They work great.
[2257.54] Stephen: I've got a purple one over there.
[2258.9] Stephen: I think somewhere they all look basically the same.
[2262.18] Stephen: Yeah, you know, it's going to get different gadgets for different chips.
[2265.74] Stephen: But now you can just use that same one for everything.
[2268.34] Stephen: It makes everything way easier.
[2270.14] Stephen: And Andrew Trichwell has created this little utility
[2276.26] Stephen: that just flashes the bootloader without you needing to download.
[2279.74] Stephen: Pack a level embedded software engineer applications.
[2283.3] Stephen: It's just like a simple version.
[2285.86] Stephen: Hit button, go.
[2287.58] Stephen: Yes, beautiful.
[2289.82] Jack: Yeah, yeah.
[2291.34] Jack: We repaired ESC for Clive and flash there.
[2295.14] Jack: I'm still basically I am enjoying I am 32 because it is a bit more raw
[2303.58] Jack: and I am shocked how much filtering
[2308.98] Jack: be a helly 32 does and how much it is you.
[2313.18] Jack: And really, it's very, very complimenting on your on your on your flying.
[2319.98] Jack: And I'm just like, OK, fair enough, fair enough.
[2322.54] Jack: I'll take that.
[2323.74] Jack: But then, oh, my word, like I.
[2330.26] Jack: You know, I'm 32 is very sort of like visceral and raw, very smooth.
[2335.86] Jack: But when I show up and high up on the throttle,
[2339.14] Jack: I am getting the sort of like jitters and like pitch jitters and sort of it
[2344.22] Stephen: going a bit crazy, because you're more D gain effectively, doesn't it?
[2348.14] Jack: Like, yeah, I'm going to lower, lower the lower D.
[2353.82] Jack: No one likes lowering D.
[2357.5] Koel: Well, so she said, but lower your D, Jack, don't do it.
[2362.66] Stephen: Fitting diodes as well.
[2364.06] Stephen: What's going on there, mate?
[2365.54] Stephen: Yeah, old stuff. Yeah.
[2369.22] Jack: This. Yeah, Clive Clive sent me
[2374.22] Jack: a ESC to flash and it was missing a diode.
[2378.86] Jack: Oh, see the reference.
[2380.98] Stephen: That is a that is a tiny little chap.
[2383.78] Stephen: What's that? Well, what size that six something?
[2387.86] Jack: Yeah, something like that.
[2389.46] Jack: But I figured I figured an oversized one.
[2392.46] Jack: So I should do like four to four to five S and hopefully
[2397.78] Jack: because it's massively oversized.
[2399.74] Jack: It should. I think it's like a little TVS diode.
[2403.9] Jack: But like how is it?
[2406.18] Jack: Al Mack, you know, like who we're going to have on next week.
[2411.98] Jack: I, yeah, I kind of like chatted with him and sort of figured
[2418.78] Jack: they get some stuff out, but I.
[2422.74] Jack: Yeah, I stupidly should have read the documentation.
[2426.42] Jack: And I turned on sinusoidal
[2430.66] Jack: slice car and had a bit of an incident.
[2434.7] Jack: If you guys see that is I think we're going to need to begin.
[2438.54] Jack: That's like a solo.
[2441.3] Stephen: That's not that's not a field.
[2444.02] Stephen: That is a lawnmower, actually.
[2446.94] Stephen: So what are you doing?
[2447.94] Stephen: What are you trying to mow the grass in sign mode?
[2450.14] Koel: What we saw show the video, Jack, show the video.
[2454.38] Jack: It's very it's
[2457.5] Jack: it's very crawler.
[2459.18] Jack: Yeah, hang on. Let me find the video.
[2461.62] Stephen: It was very gives you that lovely, smooth sort of slow.
[2466.3] Stephen: But up to about 100 RPM, like you're not really going to fly
[2470.14] Stephen: in it now to pass Tony's bedtime.
[2473.98] Stephen: Yeah. Yeah.
[2474.94] Stephen: By Tony.
[2476.14] Koel: Well, it's funny because
[2478.74] Koel: it really was.
[2479.9] Koel: Well, you'll see in the video, I was I was kind of ripping Jack
[2483.18] Koel: a new a new derriere on it because I'm like, Jack,
[2487.9] Koel: what are you doing?
[2488.58] Koel: Disarm your drug.
[2490.34] Jack: It's it's for a crawler.
[2493.82] Stephen: And so you can do, you know, you can go up that like
[2497.54] Stephen: 50 degree incline and just
[2500.94] Stephen: slowly go up there.
[2502.42] Stephen: You need a big motor, though, because it's super inefficient.
[2505.9] Stephen: So it's dumping current into the motor and the motor is getting super hot.
[2509.78] Stephen: And if it's like, you know, a 22 motor, it's going to burn the crap out of that.
[2514.82] Stephen: It's designed for like, you know, 30, 30 size, 40 size motors.
[2519.26] Stephen: Big bastards that have a lot of thermal mass.
[2523.43] Koel: Well, so.
[2525.75] Koel: I know, Jack, you were you were kind of going on and on about sinusoidal
[2532.19] Koel: startup or whatever, right?
[2533.55] Koel: Or I don't know what the correct term is, but
[2537.55] Koel: it's weird how because it's technically the superior thing, is it not?
[2542.55] Koel: It's not.
[2543.35] Koel: No, it's not.
[2544.35] Jack: It's designed for crawlers.
[2545.75] Jack: I should have I should have definitely checked it out.
[2549.99] Jack: You know, like just RTFM.
[2553.99] Jack: Yeah, I mean, it was like a five second Google search, but it was just like
[2560.59] Jack: I just kind of like wanted to.
[2564.47] Jack: You know, it's like kind of playing.
[2565.99] Jack: Yeah, playing with settings and seeing how much they started up.
[2569.19] Jack: And I did the same thing.
[2570.67] Stephen: And like I got a funny smile.
[2574.51] Stephen: I think I may have like done a little bit of damage to some coils.
[2577.87] Stephen: But yeah, with sinusoidal, you're getting like literally a nice smooth sign curve.
[2582.47] Stephen: And you think, oh, that looks lovely.
[2584.47] Stephen: But when the moat, when when you're driving a phase and it's not at minimum
[2592.43] Stephen: or maximum, you're kind of just wasting power because with a quad motor,
[2598.67] Stephen: it's all about making the change as quickly as possible
[2601.27] Stephen: and just flipping from on to off and on to off.
[2604.47] Stephen: And when you're in between that, you're kind of just
[2607.63] Stephen: passing away power and it just turns up as heat.
[2611.63] Stephen: So it's it's not great.
[2614.63] Koel: So Jack was upside down and didn't disarm and disarm his fucking drone.
[2622.55] Jack: Is it burned? No, it's fine.
[2625.19] Jack: It's just full of grass.
[2626.55] Jack: It's like mowing your lawn, raking up every bit of grass
[2631.39] Jack: and then stuffing it into the inside of my head when it was upside down.
[2635.15] Stephen: And you're like, I don't need to disarm.
[2636.79] Stephen: I can rescue this.
[2638.23] Jack: I think it was too busy laughing.
[2640.07] Jack: I think I was too busy just like, oh, this is great.
[2643.75] Jack: Well, that's what I was like.
[2645.47] Koel: I was like, OK, he's upside down.
[2647.35] Koel: OK, go for the walk at the quad.
[2649.95] Koel: No, I'm leaving my quad armed and spinning.
[2653.79] Koel: And then I'm going to try and turtle and keep the props spinning.
[2658.99] Koel: But would I guess props out of props in wouldn't matter in that case, would it?
[2664.39] Stephen: Props out might have the amount of rocks that's flying.
[2667.83] Jack: Are you flying props in and that?
[2669.71] Jack: No, like the props out.
[2671.63] Jack: The trouble is with props, props out is that the rear ones
[2675.15] Jack: then sling grass into the inside of your quad.
[2678.79] Koel: Yeah, I mean, you could say it's just the benefit.
[2681.51] Koel: Yeah, give me the grass, give me the grass, give me the grass.
[2685.59] Jack: Props in just slings grass and crap into your lens.
[2690.07] Stephen: You've got to put that in like a dry cupboard and come back to it
[2692.83] Stephen: a day or two later with a brush.
[2694.99] Jack: Yeah, no, I can get it the next day.
[2697.27] Koel: I was very I saw him cleaning it and his quad looks brand new again.
[2701.43] Koel: I couldn't believe it.
[2703.31] Stephen: I mean, he's very, Jack, you're very good at cleaning stuff.
[2706.59] Stephen: You are ultra disciplined.
[2708.23] Stephen: I'll give you that.
[2710.87] Koel: He's like, what are you talking about?
[2713.11] Stephen: He's got his ultrasonic cleaner.
[2714.75] Stephen: He's got all the solutions and the brushes like a electrical engineer's approach.
[2719.79] Jack: Yeah, the trouble is you can't put a fly controller into a ultrasonic cleaner
[2725.83] Jack: or a quad because it will it will destroy the gyro, the MCU.
[2733.55] Jack: Because it's fun to make a mechanical and select from.
[2735.55] Jack: Yeah, yeah.
[2736.99] Jack: So you can't.
[2738.95] Jack: Yeah, so you yeah, you can't stick that in.
[2741.83] Jack: And then also you can't stick your motors in there
[2743.67] Jack: because it will strip all the oil out of your bearings.
[2746.59] Jack: So then you have to peel all the bloody
[2749.55] Stephen: what is it like a bit of a miso and a brush and.
[2752.87] Jack: Yeah, a bit bleach and whatnot.
[2756.07] Jack: It was just like, wow, you really went to town on it.
[2759.07] Jack: Yeah, well, it's all gamut matter.
[2760.75] Jack: You got to. Yeah, you got to use
[2765.59] Jack: like some sort of detergent.
[2767.95] Koel: And I was surprised by that, too.
[2769.79] Jack: And I never knew that.
[2771.75] Koel: Yeah, I will say Jack is
[2774.87] Koel: kind of like a mastermind when it comes to a lot of these little things,
[2778.19] Koel: things I would have never thought of.
[2779.71] Koel: And it's like, oh,
[2782.11] Koel: that's why that's why I consult with Jack for like so many things.
[2785.63] Koel: I'm like, I don't know anything.
[2788.11] Koel: Jack knows lots of things.
[2789.63] Koel: I'm going to talk to Jack.
[2791.31] Jack: Just run a just a monkey that is good at running checklists.
[2795.07] Jack: That's all it is.
[2796.23] Jack: I'm not I'm not like some sort of.
[2799.03] Jack: That's why I'm just a real cool experience, my trust me.
[2802.27] Jack: Well, you know, I just I got good at building quads because I crash along.
[2806.99] Koel: Well, see, I reap the benefits of that.
[2809.87] Koel: Then keep crashing and keep fixing it.
[2812.43] Koel: And I love it.
[2813.87] Jack: I will. No, I mean, you've done the legwork.
[2816.35] Jack: You stayed in the you stayed in the simulator.
[2818.51] Jack: That's why everyone's like, you're a liar.
[2820.43] Jack: I mean, fly for six months.
[2822.43] Jack: Yeah, it's like, yeah, he spent six months in the simulator.
[2825.75] Jack: You know, you might as well call you Rydon.
[2828.71] Koel: It was crazy, man.
[2829.55] Koel: Like one of my first friends, like literally one of my first flights
[2834.43] Koel: was at a freaking construction bando.
[2837.75] Koel: And I was doing like crazy stuff.
[2839.43] Koel: And everyone was like it was just analog DVR at it.
[2841.87] Koel: But like people were wondering like how long I've been flying for.
[2844.83] Koel: And they were like, what?
[2845.67] Koel: You've only been flying for like the song.
[2847.19] Koel: I'm like, simulator.
[2849.39] Stephen: Which simulator do you recommend for freestyle?
[2851.83] Stephen: And what's your go to?
[2853.15] Koel: Well, I only really have used one.
[2855.27] Koel: Like I've played around with I've used curry kitten simulator.
[2858.91] Koel: I've used trip.
[2862.31] Koel: And I think I've used whatever Jack has on his
[2865.47] Koel: list of uncrashed.
[2868.55] Jack: I have got
[2871.63] Jack: I have got a velocidrome, but I just don't know my log in.
[2874.91] Jack: So so what do you say?
[2876.23] Stephen: You only used one and then you list five others.
[2878.19] Stephen: What do you want one that you've used?
[2880.27] Koel: So I solely used and learned, learned, learned on liftoff.
[2883.83] Koel: That was that's it.
[2885.39] Koel: And the the quad that I learned on because, you know,
[2888.87] Koel: I can like load different quads.
[2890.59] Koel: And what was it, Jack?
[2893.51] Koel: It was it was basically it was like an alien or an apex frame.
[2900.23] Koel: What was it? Do you remember, Jack?
[2902.03] Koel: No, I don't.
[2904.07] Koel: There's like a specific I don't know.
[2906.91] Koel: He basically made it very kissy, I think he made it very kissy for me.
[2911.59] Koel: So then when I got my first quad kiss B1, it was like I flew it
[2915.83] Koel: and I knew how to fly it. No problem.
[2918.31] Koel: I still have all my original quads because I I haven't like, I mean,
[2923.43] Stephen: I don't want to try the micro drones.
[2926.63] Koel: That that is next, actually.
[2928.43] Koel: That is my next box bag.
[2932.63] Koel: OK, I'll do it now.
[2933.79] Koel: Reels. You've got it.
[2935.71] Stephen: There's a melon pan or a really nice urban map
[2942.47] Stephen: where you've got lots of little spaces and parked vehicles and inner city parks
[2947.03] Stephen: and, you know, overhead roads and stuff called melon pan park
[2951.51] Stephen: and lift off micro drones.
[2953.83] Koel: No fun. I had to try it out, but the maps are getting bigger and bigger.
[2957.71] Stephen: So they've got like a sister product, I guess.
[2961.35] Stephen: So there's micro drones that's purely for whoops
[2963.75] Stephen: and then a regular liftoff that's, you know, basically a five inch racing
[2967.07] Stephen: simulator, which freestyle and more micro drones.
[2970.15] Stephen: One is just on whoops, basically.
[2972.31] Stephen: So indoor environments, really tight spaces and lots of funny little gaps.
[2977.19] Stephen: And you'll be there's one level that's purely kind of flying around
[2981.03] Stephen: a fairly small apartment with a little bit of a
[2986.47] Stephen: garage outside and kind of garden area.
[2990.27] Stephen: And you're just doing all these laps through really tight gaps.
[2993.19] Stephen: It's it's quite inventive.
[2994.95] Stephen: The level design is really nice.
[2997.95] Koel: Yeah, you know, I've actually I've never flown a tiny whoop.
[3001.79] Koel: Well, actually, that's kind of a lie because
[3006.63] Koel: the first time that I ever tried
[3010.07] Koel: Acro on a quad was in 2018 at Jack's house.
[3016.63] Koel: And I had never even flown FPV before this.
[3019.47] Koel: And he's like, you're fly a little micro tiny whoop in the house.
[3023.15] Koel: Here's a here's the radio.
[3024.31] Koel: And there you go.
[3025.67] Koel: Line of sight. And I'm like,
[3028.11] Koel: line of sight.
[3031.39] Koel: Quads just like it's just everywhere.
[3033.39] Koel: Like I couldn't even take off.
[3035.43] Koel: And but yeah, I'm
[3039.43] Koel: I want to I want to try out some micro some micros in real life.
[3043.27] Stephen: It's going to be that time of year, man.
[3044.79] Stephen: You've been a lovely sunny Canada.
[3046.59] Stephen: Can't say sunny forever.
[3048.11] Stephen: Sorry, Jack. I'll cut you off.
[3049.31] Jack: Indoor malls. Sure can.
[3051.23] Jack: Yeah, Cole, Cole screamed at me and was like,
[3054.27] Jack: but that's dangerous and out of control.
[3056.87] Koel: There's no control.
[3059.11] Koel: No, I was like, I'm with a mavic.
[3062.55] Koel: I have so much control over this thing, man.
[3065.35] Koel: Dude, I'm in control with a mavic and I have no control
[3068.59] Koel: with this little acro, you know, full manual control.
[3073.75] Jack: That's what I love about Cole now versus old.
[3078.31] Jack: And I'm like, yeah, and he starts like
[3081.75] Jack: bloody giving me like technical bloody breakdowns of stuff.
[3086.39] Jack: And I'm like, who are you?
[3088.15] Jack: Yeah, I know.
[3091.83] Koel: You know, I feel like I'm way better off now
[3093.99] Koel: because I can actually repair that's not even drone related.
[3096.95] Koel: Like I can I can fix things that otherwise nobody else would be able to do.
[3101.75] Stephen: That's the DGI ban.
[3103.67] Stephen: Like, is that happening over there now?
[3105.91] Stephen: I know you're a troublesome country that the unruly teenager
[3111.31] Stephen: that is at your southern border is talking about banning DJI.
[3114.95] Stephen: And lower barrels of Canada.
[3117.15] Stephen: The lower barrels of Canada.
[3118.67] Stephen: What about Canada? Are you staying with DJI?
[3122.35] Koel: I mean, I got some little DJI
[3124.83] Koel: mini drones that work just fine.
[3127.51] Koel: And I saw some I saw some video about
[3131.71] Koel: the original D back, sorry, original dobo
[3135.83] Koel: that apparently he had a air 3S coming in from DJI and it got stopped at the border.
[3143.39] Stephen: Are they actually full on banning stuff now?
[3148.95] Stephen: You say stuff's getting stopped at the border.
[3150.91] Stephen: It's actually happening now.
[3152.63] Stephen: I don't know.
[3153.31] Koel: Well, I think that's here's the thing.
[3156.31] Koel: People make videos that get views.
[3158.43] Koel: So if something is potentially stuck at the border, like, is it just going through customs?
[3164.11] Koel: Is it just going through the process a little slower than normal?
[3167.07] Stephen: Like, is it because you said it was only worth like 20 bucks to avoid pay tax on it?
[3171.87] Stephen: Yeah. Yeah.
[3173.11] Koel: I don't believe that.
[3174.83] Koel: Dude, I guarantee you that I mean, Christmas is coming.
[3178.55] Koel: Lots of people are going to be having lots of brand new DJI drones.
[3181.47] Koel: Like, I don't I don't know, man.
[3182.75] Koel: Like, I think that I'll believe it when I see it, put it that way.
[3189.03] Koel: Like, that's how I feel about a lot of things.
[3192.99] Koel: And that's a really vague statement I just said.
[3195.51] Koel: But like, yeah, I'll believe it when I see it.
[3197.99] Koel: Like companies are going to continue to make money and they're going to keep selling things
[3203.79] Koel: and people are going to keep paying taxes for it, which means they're likely still going to be sold.
[3208.27] Koel: That's my sort of off the off the cup view.
[3212.75] Koel: I don't know.
[3213.99] Jack: I know a little bit off topic, but
[3219.91] Jack: I'm really I'm really sad that Tony is not here to talk about this.
[3225.51] Jack: But I went on Fox's website because like I've heard Cole hang on about the cat can.
[3231.63] Jack: And I'm oh, yes.
[3233.27] Jack: Oh, you know, I like, you know, Cole like trust in Cole.
[3239.11] Jack: But I went on and I went FPV and others.
[3242.95] Jack: Look at this.
[3244.31] Jack: We all kind of know what this is probably for.
[3249.39] Jack: Look at this FPV video scrambler.
[3254.11] Stephen: Well, it's like a d scrambling.
[3255.67] Stephen: Is this like a cable TV trip set from the 1980s?
[3259.19] Koel: No, it's just like in the kitchen when you're making breakfast and you got your eggs out.
[3263.23] Koel: You need a scrambler.
[3264.23] Koel: You know, sometimes your video, you've got to cook up your video.
[3267.31] Jack: I mean, at the end, I don't know.
[3271.15] Jack: But like I was like, well, this is a thing next to some luggage straps
[3276.27] Stephen: that you can use to maybe tie a Coke bottle onto your drone.
[3279.91] Stephen: If you need to help someone who's thirsty, maybe.
[3285.99] Koel: I mean, whatever.
[3286.99] Koel: I mean, if you need to cook, if you need to cook up some
[3291.07] Koel: some video transmission signals in the morning.
[3293.59] Koel: Hey, I mean, it's available.
[3297.99] Stephen: So just the optimism thinking that they can sell something that's got like
[3302.95] Stephen: no active components on it and is clearly the simplest thing in the world.
[3307.35] Stephen: And it's going to take more than an afternoon for someone to figure out
[3311.71] Stephen: what's going on with that signal and decode it and software.
[3314.71] Koel: I know. Well, on more positive topics.
[3319.51] Koel: Oh, here we go.
[3320.51] Koel: Oh, the ban was removed by the Senate review.
[3322.99] Koel: Now they're trying to use the slave labor cause to hold up shipments.
[3325.91] Stephen: Oh, OK. OK, so that was a ban.
[3329.67] Stephen: And then it was un-banned because money and now trying to re-ban.
[3335.75] Stephen: Under different circumstances. Yeah.
[3338.87] Stephen: It's kind of interesting, like that they definitely have a monopoly.
[3342.15] Stephen: But then like America has a lot of weird history with Asia in general.
[3348.03] Stephen: There's a lot of racism going on there.
[3350.79] Stephen: Just look at like people's attitudes to MSG, like scientific studies
[3355.51] Stephen: have showed zero problems with MSG.
[3358.07] Stephen: But anecdotally, people tell you, oh, it gives you headaches.
[3361.71] Stephen: It does this, does that.
[3362.87] Stephen: And that body of science can best be described as racism.
[3368.03] Stephen: But it kind of just stays there in popular culture.
[3371.75] Stephen: Yeah, it's interesting.
[3374.27] Koel: Yeah, that whole MSG thing is a good example, actually, because.
[3379.19] Koel: Kind of strange.
[3381.11] Stephen: Yeah, I'm all for MSG personally, just like
[3384.91] Stephen: flavor, yes, not quite as much salt as regular sodium as regular salt.
[3389.63] Stephen: So yeah, but if you less sodium.
[3393.59] Stephen: Yeah, that's why I mean, most people don't try and read medical journals
[3398.39] Stephen: in these situations, they'll just let go on Facebook.
[3400.63] Stephen: And then that's why the trouble happens, I guess.
[3403.99] Stephen: Literally, literally.
[3407.35] Stephen: Oh, yeah, we've got we go forced labor.
[3409.27] Stephen: I mean, there's the whole anti Muslim thing as well.
[3412.63] Stephen: That's real, but yeah,
[3417.6] Stephen: it's not like Amazon are a particularly great employer either.
[3422.44] Koel: Yeah, any views expressed in this by guys are personal
[3426.88] Koel: and may not reflect the views of others.
[3429.8] Jack: Good save girl.
[3431.2] Jack: Don't forget next week.
[3434.68] Jack: Send in, if you're listening to this, send in your FPV horror stories.
[3439.8] Jack: Please, love of God,
[3442.16] Jack: because I don't think I can get away with showing the time that me and Tony
[3447.36] Jack: also we have some guests.
[3450.32] Stephen: Oh, yes, we should tease. Yeah, we have.
[3453.8] Stephen: Oh, my.
[3454.8] Stephen: Jack has been busy booking people because he's industrious and well connected
[3459.52] Stephen: and incredibly attractive man.
[3461.68] Koel: He's been going and talking to our mainly attract getting getting him
[3466.24] Stephen: and also the team around AM 32, which has expanded a bunch recently.
[3471.32] Stephen: We've had, I think, one of the number on before.
[3474.76] Stephen: We're going to get a few more of them on and be talking about where the project
[3478.6] Stephen: came from, where it's going and what they're looking to do with everything
[3481.96] Stephen: there under the AM 32 umbrella.
[3484.56] Koel: Yeah, shut up.
[3485.28] Koel: I'll make some of the shots that I'll make FPV man.
[3487.76] Koel: Super cool, dude.
[3489.44] Jack: Yeah, the best story will try and make it
[3493.8] Jack: so you win something.
[3495.76] Jack: I don't know what it is yet.
[3497.36] Jack: It will be maybe it will be stickers.
[3499.88] Jack: Maybe we can all club together for some sort of gift card award.
[3505.56] Jack: We just don't know.
[3506.76] Jack: Maybe a smooch from bright until I fly signed propellers.
[3511.16] Jack: It might be a picture of Tony
[3516.08] Jack: from him getting out of the shower.
[3519.24] Jack: So hang on your wall.
[3520.56] Jack: Who knows?
[3521.32] Stephen: You can get a poster of Tony with Vin Diesel's body,
[3524.56] Stephen: which there's a small run that's talked about in the shadows.
[3530.72] Koel: In the darkest of shadows.
[3532.92] Stephen: Yeah. Yeah.
[3534.04] Jack: Do you want to see us out in Steven?
[3537.32] Jack: Well, we got to say thank you all our patrons, right?
[3539.76] Stephen: Yeah, thank you to our lovely patrons.
[3541.84] Stephen: If it wasn't for you, we wouldn't be able to do the show.
[3544.56] Stephen: You pay for the editing.
[3545.64] Stephen: You help us keep this train wreck on the road.
[3547.84] Stephen: Thank you so, so much trains go on the road.
[3551.2] Stephen: Yeah. Well, this train wreck does.
[3553.08] Stephen: It's everywhere, mate.
[3554.88] Stephen: OK, so thank you very much.
[3557.4] Stephen: This week you have been joined by Jack, aka Bright Until I Fly.
[3562.52] Jack: Thank you.
[3564.72] Stephen: Cole, also known as camera dude.
[3568.8] Stephen: Yes, sir. See you.
[3571.04] Stephen: And myself, Steven or Bellwick over in Discord.
[3574.8] Stephen: Thanks very much.
[3576.04] Stephen: See you next week.
[3577.8] Jack: Bye. Bye.
[3580.0] Jack: Good email at thrown out dot com Gmail.
[3584.32] UNKNOWN: And why is that stories telemetry loss?